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#281 Re: The Garden » Taliban control of Afghanistan on the 20th Anniversary of 9/11 » 200 weeks ago
The Taliban lacked air coverage completely, and were significantly outarmed and outnumbered by the Afghan military. Saying the Afghan Army fell because they lacked mechanics to keep their airforce operating is ignoring that countless Afghan pilots have flown out (deserted) of the country in that aircraft during the last week. I'm not defending Biden's withdrawal plan, but if you outnumber and outarm the enemy, and lose without a significant fight, you don't get to blame that on anyone but the Army who failed to setup a simple perimeter defense. Riddle me this, how many Taliban and Afghani soldiers died in the preceding 11 days before the fall of Kabul?
80k Taliban versus 300k Afghani Soldiers. And the Taliban had a decisive victory without a formal military structure and intelligence support from NATO nations.
As you are someone who has served I would actually like to hear your insight on how important the aerial reconnaissance and air strikes to how the Afghan forces were trained to fight the Taliban? Was reading this article this morning and from what I've been able to read over the past few weeks it really seems like they were setup to fail.
https://www.nytimes.com/2021/08/25/opin … -army.html
Like if they know they've been sold down the river and that their government has been as well, is it not understandable that they fold as the cause they're fighting feels hopeless?
Either way all aspects of this - from the terms of the withdrawal, the extent of it and the final evac operation - seem like they've been botched.
#282 Re: The Garden » Taliban control of Afghanistan on the 20th Anniversary of 9/11 » 200 weeks ago
US embassy issues last alert for US citizens to leave afghanistan or they’re on their own, then recalls it 30 mins later.
— Richard Engel (@RichardEngel) August 24, 2021
Three sources tell me and @AlexThomp that the Taliban has now started halting people trying to get in through the airport gates. Not just Afghans but American citizens. Informal groups coordinating need to redirect people on the fly.
— Lara Seligman (@laraseligman) August 24, 2021
And he was 5 hours late for that speech.... not looking good
#283 Re: Guns N' Roses » GNR Release 'Absurd' Single » 200 weeks ago
Do any bands release singles on vinyl these days? Like any?
I only ever see full length releases on vinyl nowadays.
#284 Re: The Sunset Strip » Charlie Watts Dead at 80 » 200 weeks ago
Just realised that the performance of Salt of the Earth with Izzy and Axl got an official release by the band on a live album last year.
and it's available as a hi-res flac https://www.qobuz.com/gb-en/album/steel … od1s827kza
#285 Re: The Sunset Strip » Charlie Watts Dead at 80 » 200 weeks ago
Sad to hear this too. 
I didn't get the impression this was on the cards so soon, I know he dropped out of the tour but he was having a procedure done - didn't think the end was this close.
James, we created two threads at the same time, could you delete mine.
#286 Re: The Garden » Taliban control of Afghanistan on the 20th Anniversary of 9/11 » 200 weeks ago
Axl S wrote:You can’t escalate this further and start shooting.
The United States negotiated a deal with the Taliban that they would leave by August 31st, excluding their ally the Afghan government from those negotiations. The Taliban are sticking to the date because they hold all the cards and have all the leverage as the US gave up all theirs.
The only way the US regains leverage is with incredible levels of bloodshed, levels that they’re probably not willing to accept.
The withdrawal was screwed with the terms of the deal negotiated, screwed when it wasn’t renegotiated, screwed in that it was time based not condition based and screwed with the execution of the withdrawal operation.
The main fuckup is with the execution. Biden is president. He came up with 8/31, not Trump, not his Generals. Joe has put America in a very bad spot because of his 9/11 exit date bullshit so he could take credit. That was a selfish reason to put our troops in harms way. We can blame trump all we want, but Joe had like 7 months of prep time to get this right. They failed at almost every level. Then, they come on TV and lie about it every fucking day. We can’t keep saying “Trump caused this with the deal” but Joe wanted this. This was bi partisan. Everyone wants out, but just like the fvcking border, there appears to be no plan what so ever to actually execute it.
You need to cool it with the Trump defense, it's a total deflection and you're being blind if you think his admin are blameless. You'll note I specifically just referred to the US, not a particular admin. It's a series of errors that spanned both admins and if you look at Western intervention in Afghanistan - it's been plagued by errors across every admin that's held the ball.
Everyone would like to be out. It would be nice to be out of everywhere and not be involved in any conflicts anywhere.
Why the exit was timebased and not conditions based though is beyond me. The exit being time based was negotiated under the Trump admin. The Biden admin got final agreement on an exact date.
Why the exit was so total and lacked thinking is also beyond me. Why spend years training and prepping the Afghan army to combat the Taliban in a certain way - using air support - and then as part of your withdrawal remove all the contractors you had aiding them with maintenance of all their planes thus removing their air support. It's decisions like that, that leave them hung out to dry - and it's insulting to totally write them off as cowards who dropped their weapons. The entirety of how they had been set up to combat the Taliban got flipped on it's head. They didn't just lose US troop presence with the withdrawal, they lost access to key tools in their arsenal.
#287 Re: The Garden » Taliban control of Afghanistan on the 20th Anniversary of 9/11 » 200 weeks ago
You can’t escalate this further and start shooting.
The United States negotiated a deal with the Taliban that they would leave by August 31st, excluding their ally the Afghan government from those negotiations. The Taliban are sticking to the date because they hold all the cards and have all the leverage as the US gave up all theirs.
The only way the US regains leverage is with incredible levels of bloodshed, levels that they’re probably not willing to accept.
The withdrawal was screwed with the terms of the deal negotiated, screwed when it wasn’t renegotiated, screwed in that it was time based not condition based and screwed with the execution of the withdrawal operation.
#288 Re: The Garden » Taliban control of Afghanistan on the 20th Anniversary of 9/11 » 200 weeks ago
Folk are demanding impeachment? He's not done anything impeachable.
And yeah Taliban call the shots at the moment because they run the place. That's what was given up with the withdrawal.
#289 Re: The Garden » Taliban control of Afghanistan on the 20th Anniversary of 9/11 » 201 weeks ago
James wrote:mitchejw wrote:You're engaging in hysteria....that's it...
This is funny coming from someone who spent four years foaming at the mouth over Donald Trump.
You basically admitted that you're just trolling now.
I'd suggest staying out of this thread from this point forward.
Trump is an indefensible moron...and here is just another situation where he'll not be held accountable...
anyway...the trump era hardened me...all these people so sad about Afghanistan...I tear up when I see a dead baby rabbit in the back yard...
my faith in my fellow American couldn't be lower, and I deeply distrust you all now in moments like these.
Can you try writing in complete sentences? Like, make some attempt at sounding coherent.
Half the things you write don’t relate to what you’re replying to or the topic at hand.
You could try to articulate why you don’t trust people’s reactions to this. You could actually write up a record of the media and the public’s logical inconsistencies. Y’know, actually engage meaningfully in any conversation.
Or.. you could just type like this... I typed once... I’ve typed before... the sky is blue... I saw a dead rabbit...
Fucking drivel.
On the one point you sort of made, Trump is being heavily criticised for the deal he made, now that folk understand the implications of it. He is being held accountable. Biden is being held more accountable because the admin he is in charge of executed this plan.
#290 Re: The Garden » Taliban control of Afghanistan on the 20th Anniversary of 9/11 » 201 weeks ago
https://www.wsj.com/articles/how-joe-bi … 1629406300
Worth a read if wanting to know how this is being perceived by the US's key allies.
