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#291 Re: Guns N' Roses » Every Chinese Democracy Song (1993 - 2008) » 312 weeks ago
Just a reminder that the topic starter is a forum troll who's posting things under multiple accounts pretending to know things while spreading misinformation.
50% of the info in the first post is nonsense.
Yes, for example, Shacklers Revenge probably existed before 1999
From Brain in 2009
“Shackler’s” was a song that Bucket and I wrote a long time ago, just jamming. Axl asked if anybody had any songs or grooves, so we brought that in. It was a riff that we’d been jamming on since the Praxis days with Bill and Bootsy and Bernie. Axl loved it and put some lyrics to it, and it became “Shackler’s.” That one might have more of a swing because it came more from me.
#292 Re: Guns N' Roses » Every Chinese Democracy Song (1993 - 2008) » 312 weeks ago
I'm interested in hearing the rationale behind the alternate titles.
Especially for songs that we haven't heard yet.
It might be that different lyrics were attached to songs at different points in time.
The start of an Axl interview from 2012
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Edna Gundersen, USA TODAY
The Guns N' Roses singer says new music will come sooner than the band's long-awaited 'Chinese Democracy' did.
Few front men in rock 'n' roll have been as controversial, sensationalized or polarizing as Axl Rose, who suffered sexual and physical abuse in childhood, led Guns N' Roses to global fame starting with 1987's Appetite for Destruction and engineered its collapse a few years later. He spent years in seclusion hiring and firing new players while tinkering endlessly on 2008's Chinese Democracy. His current GNR lineup takes the stage Wednesday night in the first of a dozen shows at The Joint in Las Vegas' Hard Rock Hotel & Casino. In a rare interview, the press-leery Rose shares his thoughts on Guns now and then, old wounds and the music industry.
New music: "All the guys are writing, and we recorded a lot of songs over the years. We'll figure out what we feel best about. Chinese was done in piecemeal with one person here and one there at different times. Appetite for Destruction was the only thing written with lyrics and melody fitting the guitar parts at the same time. After that, I got a barrage of guitar songs that I was supposed to put words to, and I don't know if that was the best thing for Guns. I do want to lean more toward lyrics and melody."
The long wait for Chinese Democracy: "I had to deal with so many other things that don't have to do with music but have to do with the industry. There's such a loss of time. It was more about survival. There wasn't anyone to work with or trust. Someone would come in to help produce and the reality was they just wanted to mix it and get it out the door. They had a different agenda. (The next album) will come out sooner."
Songwriting slump: Supermodel girlfriend Stephanie Seymour and original Guns guitarist Slash and bassist Duff McKagan "did more damage to my ability as a writer. To those three, it was all crap. It beat me down so much. At the time of the (Use Your Illusion) tours, Slash and Duff said, 'You're an idiot, you're a loser.' I didn't write for years. I felt I was hindered for a very long time. I was also trying to figure out what I wanted to say, when it's right to be venting and when you're digging a bigger hole. Lyrics on Chinese took a long time."
#293 Re: Guns N' Roses » Every Chinese Democracy Song (1993 - 2008) » 312 weeks ago
I think, going on previous interviews, there were 36 songs recorded during the CD sessions, and dozens incomplete.
#294 Re: Guns N' Roses » Better, As it Began instrumentals » 312 weeks ago
There's apparently about 90 songs in one form or another (if you believe it)
From Skwerl's account of his case, it's on page 3
Read google cache of the following
http://antiquiet.com/misc/truth/2014/01 … democracy/
http://antiquiet.com/misc/truth/2014/01 … mocracy/2/
http://antiquiet.com/misc/truth/2014/01 … mocracy/3/
#295 Re: Guns N' Roses » Better, As it Began instrumentals » 312 weeks ago
Interesting read. Here's a clip of Axl 2009 interview with Billboard about the record company;
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What are your thoughts on how Universal has handled the album?
Unfortunately I have no information for me to believe [that] there was any real involvement or effort from Interscope. I'm not saying there wasn't. But in my opinion, without [Interscope Geffen A&M chairman] Jimmy Iovine's involvement, it doesn't matter who anyone talks to or what they say -- virtually nothing will happen from their end.
I do know [that] I've been asking for a marketing plan for over five years and still haven't got anything. We've asked for a complete breakdown of promotion expenses and efforts from all parties but unfortunately I've received very little information, if anything, so far. On another note, the draft booklet leaking and, I believe, the early shipping of preorders and the inclusion of the early draft booklet for the release was through involvement with Interscope, which was a mess. That's not to say they don't work for other artists and make things happen. I feel they work very hard for whatever it is they truly want to sell, whether it's good or …
I can say how the band feels, and that is that to a man they hate the record company other than Universal International with a passion. And that's with me talking with them about the record company negatively hardly ever, if at all. They're not blind: They hear the talk and see the results. Our involvement with Interscope has been more than frustrating for them. It's not like anyone here wants to have any negative views, impressions or opinions. They don't go around bitching about things all the time and they don't let it get in the way of whatever they're supposed to do here, but it is what it is.
Here's how things worked until they were no longer involved-that is, until recently. Jimmy [Iovine] and whoever would come down to the studio. Things would be good for a month. Then, according to whoever was involved at the time from their side, someone above Jimmy would start putting pressure regarding us on him, Jimmy would start pressuring others at his label [and they] would begin doing the same with us. We get that it's just how business -- and perhaps especially this business -- tends to work, but after a month of this the whole thing would get ugly and extensively interfere with getting anything productive done, and near the middle of the third month we'd arrange for Jimmy to come down again. They'd go away happy and the entire process would repeat itself over and over and over.
[Former Interscope Geffen A&M president] Tom Whalley brought in Roy Thomas Baker to produce and [A&R executive] Mark Williams suggested Marco Beltrami, among others, to play strings on the album. And Jimmy had an idea for low guitar in a track and the EQ on a drum part. That's it as far as I'm aware. They were all good things, but in all sincerity, that's it. Now, what efforts were made to help keep Universal or Vivendi off us for as long as possible could very well have been extensive, and in that regard either would have been or would be most appreciated. I like Jimmy, but I've never understood him in regard to us or this album. Everything's always been, "That's easy," or "We can fix that, no problem," but unfortunately rarely added up to any kind of reality for us until [he found] Bob Ludwig for mastering.
We'd love to have their and Jimmy's support after this. But to continue at this juncture feeling as we do, keeping things so behind the scenes, unfortunately feels like the same 'ol same 'ol for all of us and, at least momentarily, a bit much to digest. Jimmy did point us in the right direction for mastering, and I believe he's sincere in his appreciation of our record but still for whatever reasons gave up pretty early in those areas.
We feel that, unfortunately, we've never been really anything all that much more other than a throw it at the wall, see if it sticks, no real ground work, something to take advantage of, last quarter, cook the books, write-off, fuck this headache, hoping to get lucky scam. And, unfortunately, for all their nice words and assurances, nothing that's happened since the week or so before the release has shown us much of anything to the contrary. So at least in regard to the U.S., for the most part I don't look at it like we have a record company -- I look at it for the most part like we have friendly but otherwise cutthroat loan sharks, and we were lucky to get what we got but feel we could have done more if they were at least, especially with some of their backgrounds, a bit more involved creatively. So in light of pirating and the mess the major labels are in, I have no sympathy for the record companies, based on our experiences in the U.S.
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And from Tommy Stinson in 2011
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"At first we were in there a lot. We were working on the writing aspect of it, but it just kept going on. We had Jimmy Iovine intervening in a not-so-productive way, and we had other guys coming and going with nutty ideas. My summation of the whole thing is that Interscope, when they took over Geffen, really led Axl to believe that Jimmy Iovine would be involved, and would help get this record done and make it happen. But basically what he did was let it completely fall apart. Then he had this great idea to bring in [producer] Roy Thomas Baker to make it sound better. All he did was re-record everything three or four different times, trying to make it sound like something it didn't need to sound like, and spend $10 million in the process. My two cents on the whole thing is that I really think Jimmy Iovine f*cked the whole thing up."
"It was a bummer. Most of the songs that are on the record now were done 10 f*cking years ago. But all the talking heads in the mix were saying, Make 'em sound better! Make 'em sound better!' So we kept redoing this and that. And it ended up coming back down to the same f*cking songs that they were 10 years ago, except that now they were a super-dense mishmash of a bunch of instrumentation."
"That whole era pretty much sums up what happened to the record industry. Those kinds of people, making those kinds of decisions and not really helping the artist."
#296 Re: Guns N' Roses » Seven » 312 weeks ago
I was just posting that to add to what we know.
Brain said in 2010, pardon the caps, "ITS AN TIMELESS BALLAD WITH A BLOW YOUR FACE OFF CHORUS AND A SUCK YOUR BALL SACK BRIDGE!!!!!"
So we know it's a ballad based on the Ben Hur theme, and it has orchestration by Beltrami
#297 Re: Guns N' Roses » The General (Rumors & Discussion) » 312 weeks ago
Again, Brain's comments from this year about the song
"It’s funny because how ‘The General’ came about was we were supposed to, you know, this was like building up to that show. Everybody was like “Hey if anybody has songs or shit you can bring them in. So that song, ‘The General’ was a song that from when [inaudible] and [inaudible] and I, when I wasn’t doing Guns stuff would just jam in my living room type of thing. I had a pro tool setup, we were jamming, we were trying to come up with songs for Guns and we had this song called, well we called it ‘The General’ because we were eating general’s chicken. Yet, when I turned it in to Axl [Rose] he thought it was called ‘The General’ because I was making fun of Tommy [Stinson] and Tommy was kind of the band MD, he was the musical director when we would have rehearsals and Axl thought i was kind of poking fun at Tommy like a general. Like sort of a ‘hey we’re rehearsing at this time’ and that kind of shit. I was like ‘no dude, it’s because we ate general’s chicken."
#298 Re: Guns N' Roses » Seven » 312 weeks ago
Just for completeness sake, I'll add Brain's comments on this song from earlier in the year. It's a ballad from what we know previously.
"...we were writing all these songs to try and turn in. Xtract is sort of this old school DJ type, he’s a bass player but he loves old school break beats and you know, cratedigger type of guy. So, the shit we were putting together was crazy. We were going ‘OK what sample should we find for Axl? Well he’s sort of like Julius Ceasar’ so we were trying to sample stuff that reflected that. We were looking for old school, crazy shit and I think we sampled Ben-Hur, chopped it up, cut it up and that became a jam, I think we called it ‘Seven’."
Theme to Ben Hur is on Youtube
#299 Re: Guns N' Roses » Better, As it Began instrumentals » 312 weeks ago
Fuck Bob Ezrin.
He wants writing credit, that's what it all comes down to, those residuals. Look at nearly every album he's produced and look at the songwriting credits. These leaks confirm he was completely full of shit. The songs were/are fantastic.
Completely agree
I posted it for reference as we can now hear what he heard at the time
#300 Re: Guns N' Roses » Better, As it Began instrumentals » 312 weeks ago
Interview with Bob Ezrin
I’ve read that at some point during the Guns N' Roses lengthy “Chinese Democracy” recordings, Axl Rose called you to evaluate what he had already done. What really happened?
Hm.. Well.. (ed:pause) I’m not sure!! (laughs)
I’ve read that you told him he had about 2 ½ songs or 3 ½ songs. Something like that.
Yeah, I probably did. It started off when Jimmy Iovine (ed: producer, chairman of Interscope/ Geffen) asked me for a big favour.
They were stuck, they were stuck in a studio in North Hollywood for years with Roy Thomas Baker (ed: Queen’s producer), and nothing was happening. They were paying enormous rental bills and they were paying people to sit around the studio waiting for Axl to show up and it was just a disaster.
I agreed to go there immediately and listen to a bunch of stuff. What I heard was – I don’t know how to say this without be insulting, I don’t want to be insulting because he worked very hard on it – but what I heard was something that he had painted over too many times. So, by the time I heard it, the original content was lost and it was just a highly produced piece of something…
Anyway, I agreed to help out if Axl would agree to work with me, which he did. He had the idea that the only person who could finish the album with him was me, based on what I don’t know. I came, I listened, I said to him I will listen and will give you notes we will see together. I spent a lot of time listening. I went to see Jimmy Iovine and I gave him my perception of the situation, including the fact that they had to get out of Rumbo Studios immediately – not because Rumbo is a bad studio, it’s a wonderful studio – but because they needed to be closer to the scrutiny of the record company and Jimmy’s team, so there could be at least some measure of control. And I recommended we move them to the Village Recorder in West Hollywood. So, they did that, and moved everybody there.
I had to wait to talk to Axl because he avoided me. He was nervous about hearing what I had to say. We finally met, on a night when my wife – who was then my girlfriend – came down from Toronto to visit me and we were having a dinner with friends at my house. She was cooking when I got a phone call from Jimmy Iovine saying that I needed to come meet Axl and I said “I can’t tonight. I’m booked”. And Jimmy replied saying “ok” (laughs). No he didn’t. When he wants something, he really knows how to get it. Anyway, he basically guilt-tripped me and I told him “Ok, I will be there at 8pm and I will leave there at 8.30, whether Axl shows up or not”, because that was Axl. Because last time we had an appointment at 10pm and Axl showed up at 2 in the morning. “So tell Axl that’s it”.
I went to the restaurant at 8 and a team of Axl supporters and hangers-on showed up and joined me at the table – and no Axl. Axl finally came about 8:25 (laughs). Anyway, I told him basically what you’ve heard. I didn’t tell him “you have 2 ½ songs” and when he sat down, he started saying me that he has finished the record. And I said “Axl, we are not ready to mix this record. This record isn’t ready to be mixed”.
I said “there are two great songs on it and I know that you’re capable of more, that’s the reason why I’m here. You’re such a great talent and I would do you a disservice if I didn’t tell you the truth, which is that most of the songs aren’t great. But I‘m very happy to help you get there and I believe that it’s possible, if you would like to continue to work on the record, to make it better”.
He said “I don’t agree with that. We are ready to mix”. And I told him “you have my number, if you change your mind let me know, but I have a dinner party at home now and I had to go”.
I left and I haven’t heard from him since. It was years later when it came out.