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#551 Re: The Sunset Strip » The BATMAN Thread » 891 weeks ago

Why so serious?

'66 style

'89 style

Indy style

#552 Re: Guns N' Roses » Baz talks about the general and the "trilogy" » 892 weeks ago

Mikkamakka wrote:

I guess 'Axl Lucas' had a time schedule even back in 2001, but that was a bit different. It's ridiculous and typical Axl. If you can't get something done, then be much more ambitious and have even bigger and harder aims.

Hate to say it, but you probably just hit the nail in the head there.

If Mr. Rose appeared more remote [in 2002], his vision of the project became more grandiose, people involved with the band said. He directed that music produced by Mr. Baker be redone again, those people said. He now spoke of releasing not merely one album but a trilogy. And he planned one very big surprise. - NYT

Whereas in '99, the concept of two separate albums came about.

Guns N' Roses are preparing to end their lengthy silence, as they finish up work on two new studio albums, both of which are being produced by Sean Beavan and expected to be released simultaneously in October.

The two, as yet untitled, albums feature the new line-up of vocalist Axl Rose, guitarists Robin Finck and Paul Huge, keyboard player Dizzy Reed, drummer Josh Freese and bassist Tommy Stinson. One source close to the band describes the new material as being, "Cleaner and fatter, but completely Guns N' Roses. Despite the rumours, there's no hint of any techno or industrial influences." - Metal Hammer, 08/14/99


The trilogy, as a concept, is an obvious afterthought. Some of the songs that'll be featured in this 'trilogy' will be the same ones that were around for the '99 album, only now spruced up with additional production and Bucket/BBF solos. However, this goes to show that Axl never lacked the songs to round up two separate albums. He was always investing in more than one. Whether the albums (if ever released) will effectively form a cohesive trilogy, that's anyones guess.

In early 2006, the band was working on 32 songs, with 26 almost completed. As of Christmas '07, this batch of songs now has 13 completed songs, with another 13 'almost complete', and 6 in the dark. Still, 19 songs divided between two albums means they still have a good number of tracks to work on.

#553 Re: Guns N' Roses » Richard talks GnR in Japanese Magazines » 892 weeks ago

madagas wrote:

Russ.... and common fucking business sense tells you that Axl isn't going to turn over the record unless negotiations are finalized. They are obviously not done. I just can't stand the constant ripping of band members for NO reason at all...it gets really old. They talk and they get ripped, they don't talk and they get ripped..    Fuck it...:headbang::headbang:

I do understand where you're coming from. When 4tus says something GNR-related, people say he's using the band to promote his other ventures. When he says 'no comment', all hell breaks loose at the forums. Even Tommy got the odd GNR question in every interview when he was touring behind Village Gorilla Head. Dizzy got burned so bad he's drastically toned down the number of his interviews.

They can't say shit. Not until Axl and Universal confirm a release. If they say anything of consequence, they'll risk waking Axl's wrath.

Axl and Universal won't say shit until the negotiations are done.

The silence isn't exactly a new thing, so everybody needs to cool off a bit. It's just one ridiculous album and it's done. They're negotiating on the release. I personally always knew it might come down to this - just calm before the storm. The new management will be instrumental in pulling this mess together; there's several years' worth of talking to do, and you don't just phone in a $13 Million album. Anyone who thinks otherwise is sadly deluded, and probably still compares the bugger to the Second Coming.


The darkness drops again but now I know
That twenty centuries of stony sleep
Were vexed to nightmare by a rocking cradle,
And what rough beast, its hour come round at last,
Slouches towards Bethlehem to be born?

#554 Re: Guns N' Roses » Richard talks GnR in Japanese Magazines » 892 weeks ago

Never trust the One-Eyes...

There's a little bit in Neemo's "translation" that didn't make it into the HTGTH transcribe:

Fortus wrote:

Moreover, if this album is released, and immediately following the work itself out. The other songs are too well finished and the next film after 10 years I promise you it is not (laughs).

Something to the effect of there's going to be a follow-up album in less than another 10 years, since the songs are already finished.

Chinese Whispers - In Japanese! 17

#555 Re: Guns N' Roses » Richard talks GnR in Japanese Magazines » 892 weeks ago

suntorytime @ HTGTH wrote:

and he had good news on the previous day (the interview was done on the 29th march) regarding the management

roll

Richard likely learned about it from the interweb. The news were publicized on March 27th.

Nevermind 4tus' recent 'no comments'. He's not in the loop any more than Dizzy is.

suntorytime @ HTGTH wrote:

at last the new management is decided on. things seem to be moving pretty good way.
till then they couldn't come to terms with the label so that they couldn't see the release in sight. Now with the management being set, the release in this year is finally likely.

If Beta / Del was up to that point serving in management duties, I can't blame the label for not cooperating. 16

#556 Re: Guns N' Roses » Axl's years of therapy - what has been achieved? » 892 weeks ago

I do agree with you on that - based on what I've read, Steven was closest to Slash. However, the point I'm contemplating is that Steven's dismissal was a point of no return. Izzy, Slash and Duff all left basically for the same reason, "it wasn't fun anymore". After Steven was gone (and he was certainly the most 'expendable' member), tension apparently began to mount. While Matt (and Gilby) seemed to click rather well with everyone, Steven leaving was begin of a downward spiral for the band. Izzy leaving next was only the next logical step. The changes in Axl without a doubt hurt him the most, as they'd grown up together and Izzy was frankly the sort of person who didn't really need all that stardom. While he was no saint back in the day, he chose to go down the path Axl would eventually try to follow him. Only problem for Axl was that freedom through musical integrity and whatnot isn't easily accessible when you're bound to a recording agreement with a multinational label while carrying on the band name which effectively comes as both a curse and a blessing.

Steven's leaving Axl could rationalize. Izzy he took as personal betrayal. Izzy's absence was also one of the likely reasons the new album took so long to come by. Izzy had lost faith in GNR.

#557 Re: Guns N' Roses » Axl's years of therapy - what has been achieved? » 892 weeks ago

Scabbie wrote:

If he doesn't release Chinese Democracy it will be deemed a failure anyway so he might as well get on with it.

Well, it's a bit of a curate's egg...

In Axl's mind, complete success is set against complete failure. For years, his line has been/was(?) that either it should be the greatest rock album in the history of music, otherwise the egg will land on his face. The only way to shield himself from criticism is to not do anything; no touring, no music. Once you spend enough time wandering in the emptied halls of the mansion, lit up mainly for the holidays with a diminishing group of close friends, you can really get second thoughts with even the most beautiful compositions.

Axl Rose isn't Howard Hughes of Rock N' Roll.

He's Charles Foster Kane of Rock N' Roll.


The question remains, what was his Rosebud? Should life imitate art, it would the slightest thing, something people around him (as well as on the forums) have overlooked. That one miniscule thing that caused his undoing at the peak of his powers. It's something money cannot buy. I do not attempt to sound like an oracle (and a part of me loathes dissecting such personal matters), but in 1990, Axl's success story showed its first cracks. Steven was fired from the group of guys who lived together, broke bread and shared a dream. They became GNR together; imagine a situation where you'd have to part with one of your best friends in the middle of something you've both wanted to achieve together. Axl's decision came with a terrible responsibility regardless how righteous it was. Soon afterwards, he and Erin lost an unborn child. All the while he was expected to follow the lightning in a bottle which was AFD. It's an underappreciated miracle that he managed to complete his work and tour extensively behind it. And then again, losing the marriage and a fellow founder of the band might've been things Axl wanted to push aside in order to become what he did. No surprise the flamboyant behavior he expressed finally came back to him and he realized how many old friends actually felt pity for him at the end of the day.

#558 Re: Guns N' Roses » Axl's years of therapy - what has been achieved? » 893 weeks ago

PASnow is accurately referring to the Peter Wilkinson/Rolling Stone article from 2000, which is a rather poignant text on Axl's emotional turmoil.

Axl was distracted by events tragic, potentially tragic and strange. His mother, Sharon Bailey, died in May 1996 at the age of fifty-one. Wildfires nipped at the edges of Axl's Latigo Canyon property the same year. The following May, Axl's old friend and songwriting partner West Arkeen died from a drug overdose at the age of thirty-six. A frequent visitor to the studio says. "When Stephanie Seymour's birthday came around. Axl seemed to shut down for weeks. A lot of this record is about Stephanie: She was his perfect woman, at least his im­age of what she should be." - RS, 2000

And while no-one here knows Axl Rose personally (or as far as I'm aware of), no-one can give a right-minded opinion on how the treatment has affected him as a person over the years. We can only speculate through the public image(s) he has presented himself in.


Much of what's been going down in Axl's head (as already mentioned) boils down to the abusive stepfather and a childhood environment of fear. I figure he lacked much of the safety children need during their formative years. He grew up hating the old Bailey, and only in his teens learned that his real father was in fact the estranged troublemaker called Rose. I suppose it might've fueled a lot of anger within him, to realize all the fear and suffering of his boyhood was basically coincidental; his mother just came up with the wrong surrogate father. Not that his real father would've necessarily been any better, I remember reading a court document about his death, which was basically a manslaughter. William Rose was no choirboy, I can assure you. However, Axl went into lengths in assuming his place as a junior Rose. He adopted the family name, switched Bill to W., and to stress his own identity, assumed the moniker of Axl. Hence, William Axl Rose, son of William Rose. Not Bill Bailey.

Axl was a real hellion in his teenage years, and no doubt the rebellious nature directed towards any authority that chose to stand in his way (or sometimes just rebellion for its own sake) was an attempt to show off to his stepfather and others who'd wronged him. I believe it was Izzy who said something to the effect that once Axl started getting laid he became impossible. Axl just happened storm into the right place at the right time, meeting with all the right people and doing all the right things. He'd come back to Indiana from LA around 20 times during his first year out, but once he got his foot crammed through the door, there was just no stopping.

When he finally made it with the merger of LA Guns and Hollywood Rose, he got a lot of old friends from the Indiana days to LA, to share the riveting club scene where GNR was quickly turning into a main attraction, banging out 'It's So Easy' and meaning every word of it. Axl was finally getting some respect, a neighborhood kid had made it! Not only that, but people in high places seemed to agree to those sentiments. Geffen A&R Tom Zutaut blatantly lied to just about every other colleague in town about GNR being horrible, and signed them up in a quick sweep. AFD happened on a wave of euphoria, SCOM came out of a lickin' guitar riff Slash'd come up with. Everything was nice and Axl was living the rock n' roll version of the American Dream.

It's really the success that got under his skin. When the UYI's were scheduled for production, Axl was one home-run away from major league stardom. He must've felt infallible. He'd felt he'd gotten as far as he did for simply being who he was: Axl, the proud bastard son of W. Rose. He thought he could handle the business end better than Alan Niven, whose closing note as the GNR manager was to negotiate a lucrative new recording deal before the release of the UYI's. Band members were slowly turning from allies into nuisances; Steven's drug problems and possible encounter with Erin Everly did little to help his situation. What remains the truth in the case of Adler is debatable, however, Axl felt he'd put up a lot for Steven in order to secure his future without GNR, and thus felt seriously betrayed.

The ailing marriage with Erin didn't really help things out, as Axl was pouring the increasing pressures of the music world onto her in various physical and psychological ways. He was more interested in securing Erin than committing into matrimony; there's a well-publicized story of Axl's idea of proposal, he threatened to kill himself unless Erin said yes. Dan McCafferty maintains he was asked multiple times to perform 'Love Hurts' at the wedding. To make matters worse, Erin eventually had a miscarriage. Having adopted regression therapy, Axl used to later tell her they were a Native American couple in their past lives and Erin had slain their children; hence Axl's uncontrolled outbursts towards her. As Tom Zutaut's story ('the truth of Erin') indicates, Axl would harbor many strong feelings towards Erin in the years to come, despite their acrimonious split. He'd attempt to mend bridges with her even when becoming involved with Stephanie Seymour. The mother of his unborn child had a lot of names for herself in Axl's head.

The UYI's saw Axl literally camp in the recording studio for weeks on end, trying to finish his trademark vocals on top of what were practically finished instrumental tracks. Already then he seemingly began to feel the world was just a bit cold to his liking and felt the seclusion of the studio provided a much needed sanctuary from the outer turmoils. Again, he was Axl, and there was nobody there to tell him any different. Of course, the UYI's became the success story and Axl started to hang out with Stephanie. She already had a son, to which Axl responded strongly, having always wanted a son of his own and no doubt seeing a glimpse of what could've been with Erin in him. Dylan was perhaps two years old when he came about Uncle Axl, Axl's child would've been a year or so. Of course, Stephanie wasn't the easiest girl in town to be convinced a housewife. Axl just had the world against him. Geffen wanted the UYI's out, and while Axl was out touring, Stephanie was having dinner with the likes of Warren Beatty. Axl wasn't exactly the living essence of monogamy himself, but he no doubt felt the forces of evil were once again allying against him. The slow dissolution of the band and best friend Izzy leaving in the worst possible hour made everything all the more harder.

Axl rebelled, once again. He showed up late on stage, held excessive banquets, did everything he could to live up the halcyon days. Anything to shelter himself from a spiritual vacuum, the realization that while he could conquer stadiums, he couldn't oftentimes conquer his own emotions. 'They' said he was bi-polar, fair enough, he made bi-polarity a trademark of his. It's all in the rock star persona: Nothing is real, everything is permitted. It's no surprise he was likely very, very alone those days, not having Izzy around anymore and the rest of the band reacting to his tumultuous behavior by becoming substance abusers, something Axl could've never understood and always held against them.

Immediately after the tour ended and the party stopped, Axl said he'd like to try and establish a family life with Stephanie and Dylan, as touring had kept them separated for far too long. Soon after, Stephanie and Axl broke up. Axl'd just gotten back from a lost lawsuit against Steven, and he'd find himself back in court now with Stephanie (and eventually, Erin). On top of that, Geffen began craving for a new album, as it had been already two or so years since GNR hit their latest homerun. The price of success is that one needs to be always ready to deliver when he's up for the bat.

Searching for security, Axl turned to Dylan's babysitter Beta, who'd witnessed first-hand the relationship he'd had with the infant. A surrogate Izzy was to be found in another Indiana boy, Paul Huge. I think they were the two main people Axl laid down his arms in front of, the two people he really felt he could trust, as they'd not become tainted by sucking up to his success. But the rest of the band had become alien to him. He probably didn't even think he knew them anymore. He must've felt he was the sole remaining voice of reason in the band and needed to do whatever must've been done to keep it alive. Axl now wanted control.

Steven, Erin and Stephanie were all people who Axl must've felt ultimately tried to cheat him of his money and didn't really care for him. Same kind of abusers like his stepfather. This was likely a contributing factor as to why Axl felt he needed to take charge of the situation and save the one thing that was still his: the band. By dissolving the partnership and taking his name to nominally form a 'new' group with the identical lineup, Axl put everybody on a leash and hoped they'd have the stomach to go through the motions under his guidance. Bringing back Paul Huge (following the disastrous attempt to sneak him onto SFTD), Axl proclaimed this was the new rhythm guitarist and that the work on the album should proceed, based on the songs the Indiana boys had come up with. One of those songs was Oklahoma, which was no doubt a painful and ironic remark to Erin, set against the Oklahoma city bombings which occurred a day before their reunion in court.

Of course, the band couldn't keep up with Axl. Slash was the first to see the impenetrability of the situation. Axl had Paul on his side and he held court with no-one else. Slash wasn't the lead guitarist anymore, he was a two-bit contract player to a man he'd once called a friend. Plainly, it just wasn't fun anymore, not to mention Snakepit'd given him a reminder of what the Troubadour days were all about. So Slash took the high road, a show of character which no doubt baffled Axl for a while. When the half-complete album didn't come together despite plans to complete and release it without Slash, Matt got fired for getting into an argument with Paul. Paul hardly broke up GNR by himself. While he no doubt felt most strongly for his old buddy Axl, the tensions must've ran high amongst the members, and Paul was in a tough spot to begin with. His friend, Axl, the boss said he was in and the others had to live with it. Maybe Paul should've quit but leaving his friend into a jam might've come to haunt him in the years to come. So, he stayed, playing alongside Duff and Robin during the initiatory jams of the new lead guitarist. Duff had a child Axl never had and re-evaluated his priorities in life. Frankly, Duff didn't need to be a contract player.

So then there was only one...

That's one of the reasons CD has been made the way it has been done. People were walking out on Axl left and right, and before he realized there were no more old associates around, the door was slammed shut on the other end of the room. The echo can still be heard in the corner of Axl's mind, playing itself out every night.

#559 Re: Guns N' Roses » Why Azoff/Gould will save GNR » 893 weeks ago

Thanks for the Hicks, man.

--

Been reading about Don Arden, the erstwhile Black Sabbath manager and Sharon Osbourne, the eternal Ozzy manager. Came up with a curious little detail from the past.

On April 24th, 2001, a merger deal was announced between Sanctuary Music Management and Doug Goldstein's Big FD Management, which brought GNR under the umbrella opened by (among others) Rod Smallwood, the Iron Maiden manager. On June 30th, 2001, Dougie and Axl admitted to 'take a break from each other'. Obviously, one of the factors that contributed to Big FD moving in with Sanctuary was the fact that Axl wanted Dougie gone, yet Dougie didn't want to completely sign off with his prime client.

Anyway, here's Sharon Osbourne on Billy Corgan and others:


Osbourne's clients includes her husband, Ozzy, as well as Coal Chamber. She was hired by the Pumpkins after the band conducted a nearly year-long search after breaking with Q Prime management.

''Billy talked to every manager in the industry, I think, and he liked me best,'' Osbourne told the Los Angeles Times last year. ''And I can't blame him.'' - Live Daily, 01/11/00

As Ozzfest has developed, Osbourne has cut back on her multifarious artist management posts. Last year, however, saw a flash of her famous fiery temper. She lasted only three months in charge of Billy Corgan's Smashing Pumpkins before quitting via a legendary press statement. "I must resign due to medical reasons," it pointedly stated. "Billy Corgan is making me sick." She says: "I shouldn't have said it, but I like to be honest, and after all these years I can't be bothered being politically correct." She's also declined - more politely - recent requests for career guidance from Limp Bizkit's Fred Durst, Guns N' Roses and Courtney Love. "Although I do like Courtney," she says. "She's hysterical." - The Guardian, 05/25/01

In early 2001, the Guns were likely in the same situation the Pumpkins were a year before. The album release for June had fallen into cinders, Tom Zutaut had been brought in to get things going again as far as recording was concerned, the comeback tour planned to coincide with the CD release scrapped... All the while Axl wanted Dougie out the door. It would've certainly been interesting to see how Sharon, the Iron Lady of the music world, would've handled the Axl situation. She does have the chops to manage a multi-million dollar acts and commercialize them to death, but she's hardly a shoulder Axl could've cried on to. Definetly a polar opposite to any methods Merck ever applied.

Funny that, Dougie used to manage Zakk Wylde, when he did his try-out with GNR in early '95. That of course resulted in Zakk dropping out of Ozzy's touring lineup, because Dougie was playing both ends, getting Zakk in a room with Axl, Duff, Slash, Matt and Dizzy to perhaps get the jams going, while simultaneously attempting to raise Zakk's profile in the industry, in order to get a bigger paycheck for the Ozzmosis tour.

In the end, we got Black Label Society.


And to think GNR was almost put in an indentical situation as Dougie joining forces with Sanctuary in November '06, when it was announced that Merck had resigned from Sanctuary and planned on taking Axl and Morrissey to Irving Azoff. Beta maintains Merck was relieved from his day-to-day duties in between 11/20 and 11/23, at which point the Azoff deal had likely fizzled.

Ironically, here's a comment from the Morrissey boards after Merck resigned and before Axl gave him the boot.

That Azoff may just be interested in Guns and Roses as a potential money spinner. Merck may well want to carry on working with Morrissey but if the Guns and Roses relationship falls through Morrissey may find himself on the scrapheap again.

Look at Morrissey now. He's been having getting a new album out, has reportedly turned down a hefty paycheck from the Smiths reunion and his third Greatest Hits so far has received mixed reviews. Merck's certainly applying his golden touch!

#560 Re: Guns N' Roses » Why Azoff/Gould will save GNR » 893 weeks ago

Dude,

I warned you on PMs that I'm a bit... creative. ::haha:

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