It was like 500,000. And Axl Rose isn't Ozzy.

Ozzy can barely string together a sentence. Axl on the other hand is putting on one hell of a show for a 45-year old. This is coming from a longtime Ozzy/Sabbath fan too.

Black Rain was a very formulaic album and not greatly received critically. Chinese Democracy has 14 year hype (good or bad) and the Guns N' Roses name.

A lot of people will buy it out of curiousity, some because they're hardcore fans, and some stumble into it.

And I think it's a little presumptuous to say GNR isn't relevant to today's society. Their aesthetic is classic rock-star and I think I saw some bug-eyed sunglasses, etc. Not to mention Chris Pitman does stuff along the same lines of Linkin Park. Except you know....good. And with well written lyrics. Better is a pseudo-poppy ditty with a great hook. Someone I know who "hates" Guns N' Roses loved that song. Then I told her it was GNR and she thought that I was kidding. So...go figure...

GNR's reception after the album release isn't decided yet, but it seems like you've already made your judgment. Bummer.

Here's what I posted on another forum. I have a close friend in the business, which is where I get this from.

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Let's try the whole "Bucketfoot" insight volume two without my hilarious slurs.

Okay so lets just say as jumping off point the recording of Chinese Democracy has cost $20 million bucks.

Lets say promotion, etc. takes 3.5 million. That's a net of $23.5 Million spent on the album in general. It costs something like $100,000 for radio at most for a pretty serious campaign and about $500,000 for a primetime spot for a commercial. So, hey, we'll just assume a cool 3.5.

Say the album sells 4 million copies. Roughly $12 bucks a pop, there's $48 million dollars. Who knows how it's distributed because different people on the album in the past, but we'll assume generality for brevity's sake. Usually around 15-20% but depends on Uncle Axl's contract. I don't know if there is an individual clause for each member or just an even distribution of the money given to the band.

So assuming this, $48 million dollars from CD Sales. Lets say that the band earns 17.5% from the album sales. Then there's a high tax on the earning, so after taxes the band gets about $3,360,000. Split 8 ways you have $420,000 for each member not even including other artists who have worked on the album. Whether their one-time costs are apart of the "recording costs" or not remains to be seen. The band makes most of it's money from touring anyway. I doubt Bumblefoot is going to cry if he only pulls in half a mill. Probably get him some good protection from Dark Angel.  rofl

That may seem slim, but this is a low number of 4 Million. Honestly, I think Chinese Democracy can hit 12 million worldwide, but hey that's me. So assuming that the record company gets 50% of this number in profit at the same 40% tax (I'm not certain if the tax on the record company differs, but I know artist tax is typically 40%). That would mean they pull in 9.6 Million.

If the album sells 8 million, the record company will get around 19.2 Million. Stadium Arcadium sold about 7 million just for reference. So assuming Chinese Democracy can sell 8 million copies, that's a deficit of 4.3 million bucks. This doesn't even include profit received from merchandising, touring, etc.

So yes, there are a lot of costs involved. Can they be overcome? Yes.

Dark Angel will be all over this again.

I listened to this back in the day. It was quite hilarious when he was talking about the steak and calling people "Vagitarians".

Hey everyone, I'm new to the forum but been around the GNR community for quite awhile. So hi.

Anyway, concerning the thread, I really feel the way that many in this discussion do, discouraged and confused. I was really on a high when I read Axl's letter in December 2006 because I really felt that he was being genuine and trying to best explain why the album wasn't coming out.

I remember seeing a teaser trailer for Fred Claus, the movie with Vince Vaughn and Paul Giamatti and at the end it said, "Coming Christmas 2007". Since Old School is a favorite movie of mine, I thought that it could be pretty solid (although I didn't care for the final product) but was bummed that the movie wasn't going to be out for a whole year. Then I remember thinking, 'Oh, atleast Chinese Democracy will be out by then.'

Well, as we all know it didn't. We got some awesome new demos which were awesome but in many ways only added fuel to the flame. I don't understand why the band doesn't post a picture of Axl and Robin together in the studio or someone like Richard talking about his experience on tour. It's really not that difficult.

"But again, without full knowledge of the various dynamics and circumstances involved, these types of comments or commentary are just uninformed, disassociated, generally useless -- and often hindering -- speculation."  This statement from the Letter really gave me inspiration to trust Axl and after listenening to the new songs such as Madagascar and Better, the lyrics really resonated with me. 'I won't be told anymore, that I've been brought down in this storm' and 'A broken heart provides the spark for my determination'. Coming off a huge breakup with a girl that was 'quite marriable', I really connected with the new songs and legitimately identified and felt bad for the guy.

Well it's 2008 and here I am much like I was at the end of the 2002 Tour, about to quit listening to GNR and going on the Forums for good. It's easy to point fingers and blame-shift and I'm sure much of the delay is more complex that we can imagine and I personally think no one wants the album out more than Axl. He's been the butt of endless jokes and made into a monster by uninformed journalists. I hardly think he wants that to continue. Even in such a discouraging time I'll defend Axl and the new lineup, they're really brilliant. I just wish that Axl would focus on people like us, sticking it out. I feed off of negative criticism in many facets of my life, but sometimes you have to take a step back and take a view of things.

But in the end, I don't think he's doing it for us. And eventhough I really don't want to continue following the Chinese Democracy saga for many reasons I do. The end of Merck's letter summarizes exactly how I feel:

"I believe in Axl Rose. I promise you Chinese Democracy is worth it and you should keep the faith. I will walk away knowing I have done my best and that next year will see Axl recognized not only as a great singer and rock icon but as one of the greatest artists of all time. "

I just hope that the album comes soon and Axl can really reap the benefits. I really think 2008 will be his  last chance.

>Bucketfoot