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#71 Re: Guns N' Roses » 11-21-2012 The Joint, Las Vegas (Being filmed in 3D) » 676 weeks ago
He was running all over the place in 02, also. He had his best string of shows right before he quit the tour. And again, touring is where he makes his living. Staying home gets him nothing. Touring the past 4 years with nothing to promote doesn't show me he wants to tour because he loves touring. And I'm sure that in his mind giving the fans a three hour show is giving them their money's worth.
This isn't really a knock. I'm saying the vocals mysteriously returning to the 02 level strikes me as following a certain pattern. We know he can turn it on sporadically during the show when he wants to. He just doesn't want to.
We'll have to agree to disagree then. There are far too many years of not touring and at least one prime example of Axl making it clear with his body language that he did not want to be singing at a particular show for me to believe that he does not want to be touring at all.
Ali
#72 Re: Guns N' Roses » 11-21-2012 The Joint, Las Vegas (Being filmed in 3D) » 676 weeks ago
Ali wrote:misterID wrote:I think the tours from 09-13 could be called: "Axl needs the money."
It's lazy singing. He puts on a good show, but it's without the bite he had in 06 when it seeemd like he had something to prove, or he actually wanted to be there. That he wanted to kick ass. He put on a good show in 2002, too. And he made it clear afterwards he didn't want to be there and it was forced on him. It's the same feeling Im getting here. Some of those 02 shows were fucking tight. Axl's voice was not.
And yet he puts on a three hour show or more, night after night. If he didn't want to be there, why go to that extent? Why play that long? That doesn't add up to me.
I think he deliberately sings with a cleaner tone, or makes a deliberate effort to sing with that tone. I think that may be because of a concern over vocal wear and tear over the course of a long show and a long tour.
Ali
Ali, they've added way more solos, jams and covers since 02. That helps extend the set, also including Civil War and Estranged extends the set. Like I said, some of those 02 shows were killer. Axl's voice was exactly how it is now, and it was clear he was coasting back then and didn't want to be there. Touring is his bread and butter.
Covers or not, they still require vocal effort. Let's not forget that he was running from the side to side in this "Paradise City" video. If he really did not want to be there, I honestly believe he would not do that. Look at what happened in Dublin in 2010 after he came back on stage. He stood there and sang in one place. He hardly moved. That was indicative of not wanting to be there. And, if he really didn't want to tour, he could do what he's done for so much of the last 20 years: not tour.
Ali
#73 Re: Guns N' Roses » 11-21-2012 The Joint, Las Vegas (Being filmed in 3D) » 676 weeks ago
Ali wrote:RussTCB wrote:I think in the end it comes down to the overall mix live. I wouldn't say he's buried in the mix live, but there seems to be more going on I guess and it weaves him in better.
When we saw them in November, I can say he sounded ATROCIOUS on RQ but other than that he sounded great the whole night.
How present the vocals are in the mix can't create a difference in his vocal tone, which seems to be the biggest objection I hear to his vocals.
Ali
It can if you can't clearly hear him. Down in the mix + crowd singing along can hide tone I suspect.
I had no problem making the distinctions in vocal tone the last two shows of the Vegas residency. For example, I noticed that during "Don't Cry", he started using a raspier tone as soon as he started singing "And please remember that I never lied...".
Even with the crowd singing along, I really had zero problem hearing Axl those two nights.
Ali
#74 Re: Guns N' Roses » 11-21-2012 The Joint, Las Vegas (Being filmed in 3D) » 676 weeks ago
Ali wrote:misterID wrote:^^
I think it's Axl going through the motions. You can't blame it on age, because he sang this exact same way in 02 and came out as a bad ass in 06. Didn't he have the rasp in 09? Yeah, I think it's a clear sign he doesn't want to be touring.
After years like 2003-2005, 2008-most of 2009 and most of 2011, I would say not touring is a clear sign he doesn't want to be touring.
Ali
I think the tours from 09-13 could be called: "Axl needs the money."
It's lazy singing. He puts on a good show, but it's without the bite he had in 06 when it seeemd like he had something to prove, or he actually wanted to be there. That he wanted to kick ass. He put on a good show in 2002, too. And he made it clear afterwards he didn't want to be there and it was forced on him. It's the same feeling Im getting here. Some of those 02 shows were fucking tight. Axl's voice was not.
And yet he puts on a three hour show or more, night after night. If he didn't want to be there, why go to that extent? Why play that long? That doesn't add up to me.
I think he deliberately sings with a cleaner tone, or makes a deliberate effort to sing with that tone. I think that may be because of a concern over vocal wear and tear over the course of a long show and a long tour.
Ali
#75 Re: Guns N' Roses » 11-21-2012 The Joint, Las Vegas (Being filmed in 3D) » 676 weeks ago
buzzsaw wrote:I don't know how or why, but Axl doesn't sound that bad when you're there. I can't explain it; it defies logic.
I think in the end it comes down to the overall mix live. I wouldn't say he's buried in the mix live, but there seems to be more going on I guess and it weaves him in better.
When we saw them in November, I can say he sounded ATROCIOUS on RQ but other than that he sounded great the whole night.
How present the vocals are in the mix can't create a difference in his vocal tone, which seems to be the biggest objection I hear to his vocals.
Ali
#76 Re: Guns N' Roses » 11-21-2012 The Joint, Las Vegas (Being filmed in 3D) » 677 weeks ago
Ali wrote:And, no, he's not using falsetto. If you listen to the beginning of "Better", that's his falsetto. It has a much lighter, airy tone. He's using more of a head voice.
Ali
You mean like what I said in the post before this?
I know your posts are tremendously insightful and articulate, but that does not mean everyone single one is read 
But, yes, now that I see it, like your other post.:thumbup:
Ali
#77 Re: Guns N' Roses » 11-21-2012 The Joint, Las Vegas (Being filmed in 3D) » 677 weeks ago
^^
I think it's Axl going through the motions. You can't blame it on age, because he sang this exact same way in 02 and came out as a bad ass in 06. Didn't he have the rasp in 09? Yeah, I think it's a clear sign he doesn't want to be touring.
After years like 2003-2005, 2008-most of 2009 and most of 2011, I would say not touring is a clear sign he doesn't want to be touring.
Ali
#78 Re: Guns N' Roses » 11-21-2012 The Joint, Las Vegas (Being filmed in 3D) » 677 weeks ago
The cleaner tone sounds terrible. It almost sounds like he's singing falsetto (which I don't believe he is, it just sounds that way). It's bad...really bad.
Don't agree it all. Though, I can understand why some people prefer the raspier tone, especially given that was historically the tone he used on the AFD and UYI records. I can also understand how the raspier tone works well with more aggressive songs, too. I never did mind the raspier tone on the more aggressive songs, but never really liked it on the ballads.
And, no, he's not using falsetto. If you listen to the beginning of "Better", that's his falsetto. It has a much lighter, airy tone. He's using more of a head voice.
Ali
#79 Re: Guns N' Roses » 11-21-2012 The Joint, Las Vegas (Being filmed in 3D) » 677 weeks ago
Yeah...saw this a couple minutes ago. Footage looks great. Sound seems well mixed except Axl's voice is off for this song. Mickey Mouse!! Everything else rocked. I do hope for a release as well.
Disagree. He may use a cleaner tone for this song/rendition, but he sounds good. I hope this actually gets released.
Ali
#80 Re: Guns N' Roses » Skwerl's post on MyGNR regarding his leak and his source » 677 weeks ago
GN'R isn't just known for four songs, though. The songs from AFD and the singles they released off of UYI are a deep part of what this fanbase loves. Again, I understand what you're saying, bono, but these concerts aren't geared towards people who see multiple shows, or follow the band on boots, like Pearl jam fans do (but I always felt that wasn't fair to the casual fan). Out of all the bullshit, I actually think his setlist is pretty cool presently. Give or take some of the solos and covers. That's one thing I think he's doing right for the fans who are going to see him.
I agree. I see people at every show I go to singing along to "Mr. Brownstone", "It's So Easy", "Rocket Queen", "Patience", "Don't Cry", and "Estranged" among other songs. It's more than just four songs that are known by people in the audience. I also agree that this is show is not geared towards the more hard core fan. Which, like it or not, makes sense to me. I think the hard core fans that are on the message boards are a small fraction of a given audience.
Ali
