You are not logged in. Please register or login.
- Topics: Active | Unanswered
Re: Ron Visiting Israel For Benefit Show
I always laugh when people bitch about Israel. Yes NALTAV that's ISRAEL not ISREAL.
Especially when they call it: the occupied territories. Guess what? Israel won a bunch of wars, and when you win you get to keep the land. Or you give it back eventually.
Maybe you can argue that when you win you get to keep it, but Israel hasn't won yet so the fight goes on (or more precisely, the palestinians haven't given up yet). While this fight goes on, we look at the inhumanity of how the war is fought, and the way the Israelites are going about this is disgustingly inhumane. Just like we are going to condemn Putin's actions in Ukraine, just like we are going to condemn ISIS in Iraq, we are going to condemn the Israelites. Unless you really are saying that if Hitler had won the war no one would've been allowed to call him an asshole anymore?
When you have Westerners in places like Canada, the United States, and they bitch about Israel. I wonder when they're going to give their land back to the Native Americans. Or when Hawaii is going to be set free. Because we're going down that occupied road right, everything should be fair game if you don't believe Israel has the right to exist.
We should never forget the horrors that the European settlers have exacted upon the American natives, but the truth of the matter is that neither of these territories are contested anymore. Palestine/Israel is.
The fact of the matter is the jewish people have been their for thousands of years and are one of the most persecuted groups in the world.
Maybe, maybe not. But an eye for an eye is the lowest, most uncivilized form of justice I can think of. Also, in the 20th century other ethnic or religious groups have seen much larger populations being decimated by wars. You just need to look at Africa, where between 1900 and 1970 there have been more black people killed than than the entire Jewish population alive today. Sad as it might be, the holocaust isn't even the largest genocide of the century.
When Hamas, recognizes Israel maybe there will finally be peace in the Middle East. Now I am not saying killing innocent civilians is ok. But, launching rockets into a country isn't either and Israel is defending itself.
Yes, they do have the right to defend themselves, but as you rightfully say killing innocent civilians is not ok. As long as Israel keeps doing that, they will be condemned for it by the international community.
The question you have to ask yourself is, how many years does it become acceptable to have a piece of land before you know people forget about it?
Difficult to answer, but it should at least be after the other side has given up...
When people recognize that Israel has a right to exist then peace can happen.
This is a sticking point to me, nothing in history tells me that the Jews have an inherent right to their own nation (just like the Christians, the Muslims, the Scientologists or any other religious group have no inherent right to their own nation). When people start realizing that everyone has the freedom of religion (or irreligion), regardless of where they are born; when they stop killing each other in the name of some god or holy book; when they stop forcing others to abide by their god's arbitrary set of rules, then and only then peace can happen.
And don't get me wrong, if there was someone here claiming the Palestinians were free of blame I would've ripped their argument apart as well. As Cramer says, both sides fail equally as human beings.
Re: Ron Visiting Israel For Benefit Show
meh...At the end of the day, Israel is there. It's not going anywhere. Sorry. I'm not taking a side. That's just how it is. At some point, "not giving up" isn't enough to justify anything, or going to progress anything or help anyone. And you're helping the Israel hardliners. The youth want to change things. Not with this. You can't have one side say their open to something, and actually give up land, and another say they never will be. That nothing will ever be good enough. Well, this is what you get. I'm not happy with what's happening, but you vote in a political group who say they want to take you into war with all the misery that follows, this is what you get. And for all the Americans jumping into this, you should be much more concerned about our own country, and what's happening in South America, where we should truly start considering Military action against the drug cartels. This is a humanitarian crisis not a foreign territory dispute.
