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Re: The year I learned how to stop caring and love the wait
It's never really that simple.
We're fast approaching the one-year anniversary of Axl's open letter, in which he announced the tentative release date of March 6th, 07 for CD. He mentioned minor, minor additions were left to be made, while Merck in a subsequent open response revealed a deal would still have to be with the label. Merck also said they'd "needed the money [from the European & US tours] to be able to complete the album and keep the band alive"; the project had been self-financed for several years now, and wasn't about to change at the last minute. "The record company refused to conclude the renegotiation until we were ready to hand over the finished album and refused to prepare a marketing campaign or commission video treatments until they had it in their hands."
One year later, there is no album out. It's said to be finished but Universal wasn't about to strike a deal last year before Axl had delivered. The reasoning that follows now is "no album this year, no new deal with the label, no album turned over to the label".
The album may be finished, you say. Damn straight, could be. Last we heard was in 02/22, when Del James descended from the mountain where the fire hasn't ceased to burn in well over a decade. Recording was completed, and the band had begun the mixing process. Baz had integrated himself into the recordings seamlessly and will have his presence felt. In other words, Axl heard him sing a chorus for Sorry after putting out his open letter and realized he could chalk it under those minor additions.
That's one of those things that stand up when looking at the CD saga. More than once, Axl's taken fancy of something and started to figure out how to implement it on his record(s), in atleast one of the songs. This I Love had a friggin harp added to it when the song was over twelve years old; not to mention the oft-rumored Prostitute which's been described as a hard-hitting rock track, despite having everything aside the kitchen sink crammed in due to the modest orchestration by Paul Buckmaster (ten 1st Violins, eight 2nd Violins, six violas, and eight cellos).
They also toured this past year. Mexico, Australia, New Zealand and Japan (with apologies to South Africa); all very easy markets, where the enthusiasm for GNR today equals if not surpasses that of Europe. Merck said the touring money was needed when the label refused to budge. No doubt the album wasn't turned over by the summer, as touring without the album in those markets is best explained by the overall lack of funds. In that case, I hope Axl arranged his extravagant afterparties out of his own pocket instead of blowing some hard-earned dime from the band's war chest.
Axl has quite obviously put his own money into the project eversince February 2004. By now, he probably realized it's not a very healthy investment and by touring, he could get back the money he'd invested on top of Universal's $13 million. Even with royalty checks coming in, it's hard to believe Axl could sustain both the financing and his standard of living for years on without getting a bit worried. There are a few choices to resolve the matter; complete CD as well as possible with the money you're currrently willing to invest (which could mean no Baz sessions, btw) and crawl back to Universal - or tour, forget label money, cover your past expenses and perhaps even generate some surplus. In this digital day and age, touring already appears to be the main source of revenue of many artists. What a pioneer spirit Axl would thus be - generate money by touring and pour it all down to an album which a great many people will download, thus stealing you from the money you invested in the first place.
The problem only comes to play if Universal still takes as hard a stance as Merck suggested. No deal with Axl before CD means Axl could continue to negotiate with them and simultaneously finalize his album as long as he'd like, but they wouldn't give a damn before he'd actually turn it over. Every time he goes on tour, he buys more time. Every time the fanbase cares less. One might compare the situation to the Halloween parties he tends to host in Malibu.
Axl throws a costume party every Halloween for friends and their families. Enormous pumpkins ring the swimming pool, and spider webs hang in the trees. Specially built mazes and forts rattle with squealing children. Almost as excited as a child, Axl himself has been known to dash around and toy with every attraction. One past guest gets the impression that Axl is trying to re-create his own childhood, albeit one better than his actually was. The Halloween scene in the past few years hasn't been what it once was. "His parties have been getting smaller and smaller," recalls one recent guest. "The ever-shrinking universe." - RS, 2000
Of course, there's an exit. Various ("final") mixes of several songs do exist; the catch-22 is that they are behind a lock and key due to Axl's (n)ongoing negotiations with the label. If you'd ask the band, the response would be that there are no "final mixes", because those'd be the ones that would eventually be featured on the album. But then there are these "work-in-progress final mixes", which are an excellent way to measure the public interest regarding the project, and the only way imaginable to shift the pressure back to the label's end. "Release it before it all leaks, along with your $13 million."
If, by now, Axl has a trilogy of discs being readied, he has a good amount of potential tracks that might trickle out in the times to come. Those three tracks on Angel Down were nothing if not a short run of leaking Sorry. As long as the stalemate persists, Axl needs to remind everybody of what they're waiting for in the first place. That's the only real way to keep the audience on his side, and he does need to gather some major outside interest if he'd want to impress Universal.
Next year, the stakes get even higher as Axl's not getting any younger. 46 in less than two months, man. Isn't it time to take the stage again and say just one word?
"Sorry."
- DoubleTalkingJive
- Rep: 74
Re: The year I learned how to stop caring and love the wait
It sure worked with me as far as wanting more with Axl on Angel Down. He sounded perfect 
I have posted since I listened to those songs that it's great and it's not great all in the same because it makes you want to hear more of Axl and new material on officially released tracks.
I think Axl has more money then people realize, his royalties are tremendous, think about how many times you hear old GNR and how much money he has made off the tour and merchandise. I wonder how much Axl got for WTTJ and SCOM being on Guitar Hero. I sure hope Axl and Univ. can come to an agreement if they are having differences because one thing is for sure, if that is the deal, they really are hurting the fans. Univ. isn't going to get their money back anytime soon if this continues, if that is the deal.
Re: The year I learned how to stop caring and love the wait
Excellent post. That Halloween example you posted pretty much describes the fanbase perfectly. I also agree that we will get more leaks eventually to try and rally his hardcore base once again. If there is another tour, we will definitely get leaks because its the only way the tour could possibly get any mainstream media attention.
For there to be interest in this album from the general public, a new leak needs to actually chart and create interest, and I'm not talking about charting at one radio station where 30 nerds requested it a hundred times each. I mean national attention and it show up on real rock/top 40 charts.
Re: The year I learned how to stop caring and love the wait
I think Axl has more money then people realize, his royalties are tremendous, think about how many times you hear old GNR and how much money he has made off the tour and merchandise. I wonder how much Axl got for WTTJ and SCOM being on Guitar Hero.
Well, Axl did sell his 1/3 of the publishing rights to the GNR back catalogue (along with 100% of those covering the future CD tracks) to Sanctuary Publishing in January 2005. The deal ends in 2025, and the rights are then reverted. The estimated value of the rights was $19 million. While I don't know whether Sanctuary Group (or it's new owner, Universal - of all parties!) bought the property with a fixed sum or rather by paying him roughly a million per year as any lessee, he nevertheless secured a good chunk of money right there and then.
That situation can be read two ways. He either wanted to distance himself from Slash and Duff to avoid a future situation similar to the infamous Black Hawk Down incident, or he needed the money. Letting go of the CD publishing rights wouldn't make sense in the first scenario, which is why I'm sort of leaning towards believing Axl wanted to financially secure both himself and his album.
Remember now, he lives in a big house and has all sorts of expenses everyday. Songwriting royalties (which he still receives to this day) come from both album sales and various medias the back catalogue can be licensed to; movies, commercials, video games, etc. He wouldn't have given Slash and Duff an all-access to controlling the back catalogue after fighting against it so ferociously (as Sanctuary Group was certainly keen to make big with their investment - remember their last years of drought), unless he felt he needed more money in the bank at the very moment.
Was it not Slash's book in which he said most of the money gotten out of the UYI tour was blown to the lavish parties and that Axl's bank account in particular couldn't have sustained much more of such punishment? Throw in the lawsuits in the early 90's with Steven, Erin Everly and Stephanie Seymour, all settled out of court with undisclosed sums, cumulating quite possibly millons of dollars.
All this considered, I wouldn't be surprised if Axl, while still able to pass on as the rich man, wouldn't feel all that comfortable to self-finance a production as lavish as CD.
--
2025 (twenty-oh-twenty-five) actually reminded me of Zager & Evans.
In the year 2025
If Axl is still alive
If the fanbase can survive they may find
In the year 2025
Ain't gonna need to tell the truth, tell no lies
Everything you think do and say
Is in the song you wrote today
In the year 2025
You ain't gonna need your teeth won't need your eyes
You won't find a thing to chew
Nobody's gonna look at you
In the year 2025
Your arms hangin' limp at your sides
Your voice got nothin' to do
Some machine's doing that for you
In the year 2025
Won't need no assistant, won't need no time
You'll pick your tracks, pick your mixes too
From the coils of a long youtube
In the year 2025
If CD's a comin' It oughta make it by then
Maybe Ax'll look around Himself and say
Guess it's time for the judgement day
In the year 2025
Rose's gonna shake His mighty head
He'll either say I'm pleased where the album's been
Or tear it down and start again woh oh
In the year 2025
I'm kinda wonderin' if Axl's gonna be alive
He's takin everything this old earth can give
And he ain't put back nothin woh oh
Now it's been ten thousand years
The fanbase has cried a billion tears
For what he never knew
Now Axl's reign is through
But through eternal night
The twinkling of starlight
So very far away
Maybe it's only yesterday
Re: The year I learned how to stop caring and love the wait
I'm done with it...for whatever reason, it never happens. I just wonder if Tommy misses these days..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xm5F5CJdJhg
because Axl has just simply missed the boat...
Re: The year I learned how to stop caring and love the wait
I'm done with it...for whatever reason, it never happens. I just wonder if Tommy misses these days..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xm5F5CJdJhgbecause Axl has just simply missed the boat...
You mean misses the days when he was a relevant artist? Of course he does. He flushed a giant portion of his career down a chinese toilet.
Since you seem to be about the biggest Stinson fan at these sites, do you think he regrets joining GNR?
I think most of these guys(specifically Tommy and Robin) are going to start questioning the time they have put in to this project and whether or not its really worth it(regardless of it being released or not). These guys are getting old, and in the case of Finck, his resume is way too small to just languish in purgatory like this for the rest of his career. At some point Robin is going to want to have a career, and I don't blame him.
Re: The year I learned how to stop caring and love the wait
The album may be finished, you say. Damn straight, could be. Last we heard was in 02/22, when Del James descended from the mountain where the fire hasn't ceased to burn in well over a decade. Recording was completed, and the band had begun the mixing process. Baz had integrated himself into the recordings seamlessly and will have his presence felt. In other words, Axl heard him sing a chorus for Sorry after putting out his open letter and realized he could chalk it under those minor additions.
I think that they really were planning on having CD out before 2007 was over.
When the band were on Oz and I met a few of them at their hotel while my mate and I were sitting in the lobby drinking for half the night, we were chatting to Axl's 2 limo drivers to pass the time.
Anyhow, they didn't really know a lot about GN'R and as far as they were concerned it was just another job. We were trying to pump them for a bit of info and we were also trying to wind them up by saying that next time Axl is in the car with them they should ask him when Chinese Democracy is coming out (they had no idea about CD). Unfortunately we couldn't keep a straight face and started laughing then one of them clicked and said - I think I was told by someone that's the one question I shouldn't ask.
Anyhow, we asked if they had mentioned it in conversations at all. One of them said that on one occasion Del was in the car and chatting to them about it and he mentioned that they hoped to have a single out in September (in hindsight a wise person may have asked - September of which year). But still, I found that interesting since the limo guys had no knowledge or interest in GN'R so I doubt they would have been fed bullshit just for the hell of it, since the info was unlikely to go anywhere.
But obviously that date has been and gone and who knows what happend. But it leads me to believe that at least it appeared even while they were doing the Japan/Oz/NZ etc tour they still hoped to have the album out shortly after that.
- Jimmy Zig Zag Bobiadis
- Rep: 25
Re: The year I learned how to stop caring and love the wait
I dont think Tommy regrets being in Guns N' Roses. He's been there and dedicated for so fucking long now I'm sure its become a huge part of him. And he's also been able to work on his own stuff, like VGH - one of the best solo albums of any gnr member(past or present). And playing to over a million fans in the last 2 years in front of countless sold-out crowds.. hardly flushing career down a toilet.
Re: The year I learned how to stop caring and love the wait
I just wonder if Tommy misses these days..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xm5F5CJdJhg
I sincerely hope he does. The Mats could enter the studio tomorrow and have a classic album pressed by the end of next week. 
Kiss me on the butt
edit : Thinking about this more, and after re-reading the thread I have to disagree with Jimmys comments.
I dont think Tommy regrets being in Guns N' Roses. He's been there and dedicated for so fucking long now I'm sure its become a huge part of him. And he's also been able to work on his own stuff, like VGH - one of the best solo albums of any gnr member(past or present). And playing to over a million fans in the last 2 years in front of countless sold-out crowds.. hardly flushing career down a toilet.
There will come a time when Tommy begins to question why he is in Guns N Roses. He has dedicated 10 years of his life (almost) to a band that has officially released no original material to date. Instead of touring the world coverings songs which he had no input in creating he could be touring the world playing his own back catalog of Mats material with Westerberg.
Is Tommy honestly that happy playing only 3-5 NewGNR songs per set with the remainder being filled up with Appetite covers? He certainly didn't seem happy throughout the last tour (I specifically recall joining in a chant at Hammersmith, London of "Cheer Up, Tommy!" ~ a chant that Axl started if I'm not mistaken.)
As each day passes Guns N Roses seem to be becoming less relevant in todays market, constantly unable to move forward. The Replacements on the other hand seem to generate an even larger cult status, the kind of status that record labels have been offering to pay large sums of money for (though not quite enough according to Paul). If Axl doesn't stop this stalemate bullshit with the record label next year I see Tommy walking...
With any luck it will walking straight into a Replacements reunion with Paul that will sell-out worldwide (albeit to smaller venues), not to mention pressing an album within months that will receive critical acclaim.
edit part deux : My memory is a little fuzzy from all the dope but didn't Tommy join Guns N Roses in April 1998? When April swings around next year that will be ten years since Tommy joined GNR. Ten years and no album. Hardly something to celebrate in my opinion.
Jeez, I'm being a miserable bastard tonight
