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- TheSundanceKid
- Rep: 30
Re: Appetite for Democracy
this release is not amongst my favourites, but it's not a tragedy either. the beginning of the show is actually quite strong, just later it gets meh. no need to bash Ashba, he was doing his best during his stint. and remember he was probably the only guy in GNR, who never got to record and release anything with the band, at least amongst those who lasted more than a month or so. even Mr. Gilby Clarke got his chance to carve something in stone at The Spaghetti Incident. remember that Axl RIR3 quote? it's always hard to ask a musician to play stuff created by other musicians. and in Ashba's case, it was extremely similar situation to earlier years, when Robin Finck was forced to play Slash's stuff, and that really couldn't click in. and later he got to play his own creations and was absolutely shining. so don't bash Ashba, better go check the first Beautiful Creatures album or the first Sixx:A.M. album - both of those have Ashba prominently on lead guitar and that's where he is at his best.
I hate Motley Crue style of rock, which is what basically Sixx: A.M. is.
It is cock rock hair metal.
I can't get behind the terrible image the guy represents.
And he just is not in the same league as Buckethead and Robin Finck. Those guys are light years ahead. Robin Finck gets shat on a lot. But, he wrote a shit ton of material. Multi instrumentalist. Was in the band twice. And is a true artist in his craft.
Axl presented the band as moving forward in its sound. DJ Ashba represented a pull backwards.
So that's why some people like myself think he is nothing but a cunt.
And it is a blight on the Guns N' Roses legacy when he joined the band.
- monkeychow
- Rep: 661
Re: Appetite for Democracy
This is going to sound objectionable to most folks on here probablty..but
Personally I love Motley Crue, and I think ashba did some good stuff with them behind the scenes on the Saints Of LA album.
I've tried to get into Sixx:Am but it's too kinda modern or something for me. I like the occasional song but it's almost like it's not motley enough for my taste hahaha.
I'll admit DJ isn't in the same league of guitar player than Buckethead or Bumblegoot. But in fairness - that's an elite level of playing - you're looking at guys like Vai and Satriani and that kinda type of player at that level - virtuoso guitarists rather than rockers as such.
I thought musically DJ did an honourable effort at trying to replicate what Slash did. Guitarwise slash is the player of his generation, and his guitar sound is fundemental to the first 5 GNR records - DJ seemed to respect and appreciate that - and although he isn't as good as Slash - he seemed to be trying to honour the music which I respect.
The part I didn't like about DJ was his stage outfits. His look would be well suited to the crue (which I love, but it's not GNR) and it didn't fit will with GNR to me - and I didn't like how he seemed to be sort of move for move trying to impersonate slash. Musically it's good to replicate Slash's parts faithfully - but like trying to move like him and be him on stage crossed the line from tribute to slightly awkward to my taste.
That said - when Metalalex and I were at GNR back in the DJ era - he gave us some of his drinks on stage and he was a totally fun and cool guy to watch. So like I don't have too much to say about him that's bad at all. He isn't slash but that's not his fault - and he got a bit over the top with the tribute perhaps - but I respect that he's a fan too and he was trying.
I also believe based on how he wrote with Motley that he would have made something good with Axl if Axl was up for it.
Personally I'm not the biggest fan of Robin. I think he had a place with GNR - as I like some of his contributions and I get that he's an artist or whatever - but I think that place would have been as Rhythm guy. That way he could write stuff and add the occasional small solo but be relieved from Slash-solo duties on the back catalogue.
It just didn't work with him on lead on those songs - either his chops were not up to it or maybe he was intentionally altering them to put his stamp on it - but to me that would be like Myles Keneddy adding in a new verse to Civil War to put a stamp on it. Like play shit how it goes or don't play it.
So I don't hate the guy I can see a version of the band working with him in, but he shouldn't have been on that AFD stuff. So for that reason I tend to prefer DJ to robin.
- A Private Eye
- Rep: 77
- elevendayempire
- Rep: 96
Re: Appetite for Democracy
no need to bash Ashba, he was doing his best during his stint. and remember he was probably the only guy in GNR, who never got to record and release anything with the band
Still cracks me up that this is the only studio recording of the Ashba-era band:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m3tTebts0kk
Re: Appetite for Democracy
just listening to the album again, purely by chance (because I suddenly got hungry for UYI non-single-non-hit tracks and ChiDem and AFD were the obvious choices for followings). I must say the sound is quite good, maybe even too clear, but I'm fine with that. the beginning is very strong, Axl is just shining there. too bad his voice goes to poo after a few tracks, full Mickey mode. Tommy's background vocals are subtle, nice.
I must say that the guitar work is odd there. Richard and DJ are trying hard to do their parts, but they are out of rhytm way too often. especially DJ is clueless to replicate Robin's parts, which is obvious, you just can't do that mostly-sloppy-but-sometimes-beautiful stuff well. the only guy who is shining the whole time is Ron. I absolutely adore his guitar lines, it makes the sound thick as a strong soup. this was the 3-guitar thing "NewGNR" were about. too bad this live album is suffering from too many flaws - weak vocals in like 3/4 of the album and poor guitars by guys who inherited them from much more skilled or weird people. don't get me wrong, I know they were doing whatever they could, but in the end the result is... strange.
my favourite tracks?
ChiDem, WTTJ, Easy, Motivation (yeah! the stuff rocks!), ABITW and Objectify.
Re: Appetite for Democracy
It's a shame humanity has the gene for not appreciating a good thing until it's gone.
Bumblefoot was consistently great during his tenure with GN'R.
While Axl was peak 2009-2010 and that era band was peak in 2012, Bumblefoot was a constant.
I loaded up a couple Appetite For Democracy tracks and it reinforces my opinion that the only thing I like Modern Guns doing better is The Seeker which actually has some verve and cohesion to it. If they ever do record something the speed metal thing could be a legitimate avenue of exploration. Conservative as they come for rock songs but probably their only card to play.
Re: Appetite for Democracy
yup. and it's bizzarre that Bumblefoot was hired just to a mere replication of Buckethead and for the whole stint (fuck, he was a member of the band for 9 years!) he was kind of forced to play here Slash's parts, there Buckethead's parts, with only a handful of his own solos contributed to ChiDem and some fills, mostly fretless. what a waste of talents.
Re: Appetite for Democracy
I'm not as high on Bumblefoot's original work from what I've heard but he could've cleaned up DJ's clunky riffs if they wrote an album together or Axl could've pushed Bumble's work to a new level.
And then you have Buckethead who could've written four albums in a month or two and Axl could've melted them all together. Instead, we all know what happened.
Waste of talents, indeed.
