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Re: Old WWF question...
Yeah....I have to admit that a lot of the story about the Montreal screw job story has never sat right with me...I've heard both sides of the story and to this day I don't feel like either side was telling the complete truth or in the complete wrong...I guess that's what's so compelling about the whole situation.
It was a very intense time to be in WWF...but the ground Bret Hart and the Hart Foundation were breaking in the wrestling business was unprecedented and truly entertaining. Looking back now, it doesn't make any sense...why get rid of Bret? He wasn't in it for the HUGE contracts...hell he was wrestling for pennies in Calgary until the late 80s. I truly believe that he was about loyalty and respect to this day...
but desperate times call for desperate measures...Vince thought he could unload a giant expense and devalue him at the same time with one simple move...Vince did NOT like being number 2 in the wrestling world...i think that much is obvious
If forced to pick a side, I think I would pick Bret's side...and I have waivered on this many times...but I think Bret was right...he carried WWF from 1994 until he left...he had a right to demand certian things...it was Vince afterall who wanted him gone the moment that he left...Bret had intentions of showing up on RAW the following night and losing or forfeiting the title the night after
The problem here is that Vince was burned by Alundra Blayze or Madusa as she was called in WCW. She dropped the women's WWF title in the a trash can on a live WCW Nitro and disgraced the WWF women's title for years following...can you imagine that happening to WWF title? The scenarios surrounding this time frame are amazing and entertaining to say the least.
And see that right there is why i've never fully trusted Bret's side of the story. I just don't buy with the dis-content he had for Vince and the WWF at that point, not to mention his ego, that he would've graciously forfeited or lost the title on RAW the following night. Don't buy it for a second. I think he would've taken the WWF title to WCW, and degraced it. Alot of wrestlers at that time, felt WCW was the future, and WWF was on the way out. McMahon was losing the ratings war, and Turner had an endless supply of money. Some of the JBL interviews, with him reflecting on this time is quite intriguing, coming from at that time a mid-card wrestler, who was forced to stick with the WWF. Even he himself said at the time, in the locker room, the WWF felt like a dying entity, and wrestlers were jumping ship before it sunk. No one ever expected Austin, The Rock, and DX among others to totally pull the WWF back from the brink of extinction.
Bret leaving also had nothing to do with respect or the love of the sport... it had to do with money. WCW gave Hart a contract that Vince wouldn't give his own kids, and Vince (at least at that time) had a certain line that he would not pay wrestlers higher than a certain amount of money. That it was he, who was responsible for their fame, because of their push, and really to be honest... Vince is right.
People got over Bret Hart leaving. They moved on to HBK, then they moved on to Austin, and eventually moved on from Austin to The Rock, then to HHH, etc.
History has proven Vince right time and again. Nobody will ever strongarm him like Hart did, ever. When Vince won't budge on HULK HOGAN, and won't give Hogan what he wants... nobody has a prayer. Vince will have his limits, and if the veterans don't want to play ball, he'll simply push a rookie (Cena).
Re: Old WWF question...
mitchejw wrote:Yeah....I have to admit that a lot of the story about the Montreal screw job story has never sat right with me...I've heard both sides of the story and to this day I don't feel like either side was telling the complete truth or in the complete wrong...I guess that's what's so compelling about the whole situation.
It was a very intense time to be in WWF...but the ground Bret Hart and the Hart Foundation were breaking in the wrestling business was unprecedented and truly entertaining. Looking back now, it doesn't make any sense...why get rid of Bret? He wasn't in it for the HUGE contracts...hell he was wrestling for pennies in Calgary until the late 80s. I truly believe that he was about loyalty and respect to this day...
but desperate times call for desperate measures...Vince thought he could unload a giant expense and devalue him at the same time with one simple move...Vince did NOT like being number 2 in the wrestling world...i think that much is obvious
If forced to pick a side, I think I would pick Bret's side...and I have waivered on this many times...but I think Bret was right...he carried WWF from 1994 until he left...he had a right to demand certian things...it was Vince afterall who wanted him gone the moment that he left...Bret had intentions of showing up on RAW the following night and losing or forfeiting the title the night after
The problem here is that Vince was burned by Alundra Blayze or Madusa as she was called in WCW. She dropped the women's WWF title in the a trash can on a live WCW Nitro and disgraced the WWF women's title for years following...can you imagine that happening to WWF title? The scenarios surrounding this time frame are amazing and entertaining to say the least.
And see that right there is why i've never fully trusted Bret's side of the story. I just don't buy with the dis-content he had for Vince and the WWF at that point, not to mention his ego, that he would've graciously forfeited or lost the title on RAW the following night. Don't buy it for a second. I think he would've taken the WWF title to WCW, and degraced it. Alot of wrestlers at that time, felt WCW was the future, and WWF was on the way out. McMahon was losing the ratings war, and Turner had an endless supply of money. Some of the JBL interviews, with him reflecting on this time is quite intriguing, coming from at that time a mid-card wrestler, who was forced to stick with the WWF. Even he himself said at the time, in the locker room, the WWF felt like a dying entity, and wrestlers were jumping ship before it sunk. No one ever expected Austin, The Rock, and DX among others to totally pull the WWF back from the brink of extinction.
Bret leaving also had nothing to do with respect or the love of the sport... it had to do with money. WCW gave Hart a contract that Vince wouldn't give his own kids, and Vince (at least at that time) had a certain line that he would not pay wrestlers higher than a certain amount of money. That it was he, who was responsible for their fame, because of their push, and really to be honest... Vince is right.
People got over Bret Hart leaving. They moved on to HBK, then they moved on to Austin, and eventually moved on from Austin to The Rock, then to HHH, etc.
History has proven Vince right time and again. Nobody will ever strongarm him like Hart did, ever. When Vince won't budge on HULK HOGAN, and won't give Hogan what he wants... nobody has a prayer. Vince will have his limits, and if the veterans don't want to play ball, he'll simply push a rookie (Cena).
You make a lot of valid points...but I don't know how history has proven Vince right in the case of the Montreal screw job. It's all true, Bret was disgruntled and he had a huge ego...but Shawn didn't, Scott Hall didn't, Kevin Nash didn't? I don't think anyone had a bigger ego than Shawn during that time frame.
If you mean that history proved Vince was right because he eventually turned the corner and overtook WCW...I'm not sure how one relates to another...
One thing you do have to explain is why Bret even to this day refuses to have anything to do with WWF...if it were really all about money, he could have come back in an extremely limited role and made high 6 figures easily.
Bret was a pretty simple guy...he really was...he was from Canada from a town I would akin to a midwestern, old school, family values type of environment. I think those things meant the world to him...unlike the New England blue blood that Vince McMahon was raised in...he had a pretty large business based in New York just given to him.
I'm not sure anyone knows with any degree of certainty what Bret would have done had the screw job never occurred...I'm not sure how you feel so certain that he was ready to back stab Vince and the WWF.
Re: Old WWF question...
Here's another question I would hope someone would answer:
What is the deal with the WWE and Randy Savage? Vince has basically given everyone a second chance from Hogan to Nash to RVD. He brought in guys who were successful in WCW (except Sting) and gave them a run in WWE. He rehired Warrior in 1996 (for a short time). What exactly is the issue between Savage and Mchmahon? Apparently, people don't bring up Savage's name when Vince is around because they know it will piss him off. The only thing that I've read that makes some sense is that Vince thought Savage would return to WWE in 1996 at Survivor Series, but he chose instead to remain in WCW.
Re: Old WWF question...
Here's another question I would hope someone would answer:
What is the deal with the WWE and Randy Savage? Vince has basically given everyone a second chance from Hogan to Nash to RVD. He brought in guys who were successful in WCW (except Sting) and gave them a run in WWE. He rehired Warrior in 1996 (for a short time). What exactly is the issue between Savage and Mchmahon? Apparently, people don't bring up Savage's name when Vince is around because they know it will piss him off. The only thing that I've read that makes some sense is that Vince thought Savage would return to WWE in 1996 at Survivor Series, but he chose instead to remain in WCW.
There has been a rumor around the internet for the past few years that Macho Man, sometime very late in in WWF career, had sexual relations with Stephanie McMahon...this would put Steph at somewhere around the age of 18 (1993-94).
There is no confirmation or denial of this rumor...and I doubt it will ever be acknowledged whether it's true or not. This would be incredibly stupid of the Macho Man...and would explain his rather abrupt and unmemorable departure from the WWF.
Re: Old WWF question...
Sweet, I scored cheap Royal Rumble tickets for tomorrow.
Finally, I'll have seen all five classics in person!.
Congratulations! Hope you have a great time! How much did the tickets costs for you? I'll be watching this on monday and maybe they'll get a shot of you when they do the crowd shots.
