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Re: Prostitute
The only song I feel is missing a 'Slash' is This I Love. Beginning and end.
None of the rest of these songs are suited for his style of playing.
People are associating these songs issues with the old band, when in fact, it isn't at all. Izzy would make more sense than Slash, but anyways...
The problem is.... *drum roll*
NO BAND. Yep that's right, NO BAND. The biggest thing that makes these songs the way the are, 'robotic' many call them, is because there's no soul to them. No band experience at all. It just sounds like a bunch of session musicians, with a session vocalist, throwing duct tape & bubble gum on all different kinds of takes and sessions, and calling it a 'song'.
I truely believe at it's core, that's the problem. The album is not cohesive by any means. It sounds like Axl taking this DAT tape, that DAT, this CD-R, that one, a keyboard, and writing lyrics, and laying vocals, mixing it, and bam, you have a song.
And in reality, when you trace GNR's past, that was an issue during the UYI sessions vs. AFD's. It just got worse.
As long as Axl refuses to perform, write, or throw ideas back and forth with "the band" in a live setting, the songs will continue to have this issue.
Re: Prostitute
that is the problem, axlin.
at the end of the day, someone can add a brilliant track to a pre-existing song no matter who is around or how old the song is
but when a group of people get together and do it as a band, the songs that are not working never really become songs.
these songs, on the contrary, lingered in the "see if the next guy can make it better pile" until they were finally good enough.
one man's vision with several musicians trying to fit into it.
versus
a team of musicians working together with common objectives.
axl is one of very few people capapble enough to pull it all together and make it work but the latter method works so much better.
Re: Prostitute
The only song I feel is missing a 'Slash' is This I Love. Beginning and end.
None of the rest of these songs are suited for his style of playing.
People are associating these songs issues with the old band, when in fact, it isn't at all. Izzy would make more sense than Slash, but anyways...
The problem is.... *drum roll*
NO BAND. Yep that's right, NO BAND. The biggest thing that makes these songs the way the are, 'robotic' many call them, is because there's no soul to them. No band experience at all. It just sounds like a bunch of session musicians, with a session vocalist, throwing duct tape & bubble gum on all different kinds of takes and sessions, and calling it a 'song'.
I truely believe at it's core, that's the problem. The album is not cohesive by any means. It sounds like Axl taking this DAT tape, that DAT, this CD-R, that one, a keyboard, and writing lyrics, and laying vocals, mixing it, and bam, you have a song.
And in reality, when you trace GNR's past, that was an issue during the UYI sessions vs. AFD's. It just got worse.
As long as Axl refuses to perform, write, or throw ideas back and forth with "the band" in a live setting, the songs will continue to have this issue.
KARMA.......great point. If Axl intended to be the producer, then he should have been in the studio day and night with these guys. "I like this....let's jam on that...etc". 
You can't cut and paste great rock and roll unless you plan on playing pretty much all the instruments yourself. An example of this is watching the making of Dark Side of the Moon. Waters is so intimately involved and there is a great scene with him picking apart a David Gilmour solo. Gilmour gets irritated but we know how perfect every track on that album turned out!:mosh:
- Mikkamakka
- Rep: 217
Re: Prostitute
Yeah, Axl used the NIN The Downward spiral method, where Trent added and added different pieces time to time, to make the songs 'perfect'. Difference is that Trent wrote everything by himself and didn't ask people to work on it, without 'having a vision' (according to Tommy) and without going to the studio for months; Trent made an electronica-based album where it can work and not a rock album with 'live' instruments; Trent didn't need more than a year; and last but not least Trent made a successful album that is a milestone in rock music, unlike Axl.
Re: Prostitute
The only song I feel is missing a 'Slash' is This I Love. Beginning and end.
None of the rest of these songs are suited for his style of playing.
People are associating these songs issues with the old band, when in fact, it isn't at all. Izzy would make more sense than Slash, but anyways...
The problem is.... *drum roll*
NO BAND. Yep that's right, NO BAND. The biggest thing that makes these songs the way the are, 'robotic' many call them, is because there's no soul to them. No band experience at all. It just sounds like a bunch of session musicians, with a session vocalist, throwing duct tape & bubble gum on all different kinds of takes and sessions, and calling it a 'song'.
I truely believe at it's core, that's the problem. The album is not cohesive by any means. It sounds like Axl taking this DAT tape, that DAT, this CD-R, that one, a keyboard, and writing lyrics, and laying vocals, mixing it, and bam, you have a song.
And in reality, when you trace GNR's past, that was an issue during the UYI sessions vs. AFD's. It just got worse.
As long as Axl refuses to perform, write, or throw ideas back and forth with "the band" in a live setting, the songs will continue to have this issue.
I have to disagree to this point: If you take the 2002 demos, or even the 1999 demos, THIS DID SOUND LIKE A BAND.
The problem isn't sounding robotic or anything, or just session musicans. That's taking away from how good this band was. They had a sound.
The problem is the re-recording. He re-recorded the band sound right out of the tracks. And added Ron and Frank into the mix and they ruined the band flow.
Re: Prostitute
I always found the way that the band would slave away in the studio, then send the tapes up into the hills to their masters lair for him to pass judgement very odd. I cant iimagine many musicians would enjoy working that way.
I can't believe they did it. I'd told him to blow me.
I wouldn't mind going out of my way, but i'd rather take my shit up to his house to record, and do it that way. Not sit in a studio, recording tapes, and then sending them up to Axlfuhrer's house to see if "they make the cut".
Re: Prostitute
Yeah, Axl used the NIN The Downward spiral method, where Trent added and added different pieces time to time, to make the songs 'perfect'. Difference is that Trent wrote everything by himself and didn't ask people to work on it, without 'having a vision' (according to Tommy) and without going to the studio for months; Trent made an electronica-based album where it can work and not a rock album with 'live' instruments; Trent didn't need more than a year; and last but not least Trent made a successful album that is a milestone in rock music, unlike Axl.
any attempt at going all techno/digital would have been rejected by just about everybody.
Re: Prostitute
war wrote:any attempt at going all techno/digital would have been rejected by just about everybody.
You mean like the album currently on shelves?
If he wants to take risks, just go ahead and take them. He has nothing to lose at this point.
i agree 100 percent but, as you have referenced yourself, the iron was hot for these songs to be released and thoroughly accepted in '02 and i'm sure attempts were made for that to happen.
at this point, he could've taken any other risk and it would have been better than the risk he did take, which was waiting this long to release an album he helped hype for so long.
there's also been specualtion that the initial album proposed didn't have the label's blessing. that my have played a role as well.
