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Re: Chinese Democracy Chart Positions Thread
No one ever thought he was trying to work something out with Robin, ala Buckethead up until the last minute?
What was there for him to work out? Finck was touring in support of a new NIN album. That wasn't being dropped no matter how many promises were made. You snooze, you lose. Finck was sick of hibernating.
No matter what anyones feeling are about Robin he was pretty obviously an important part of the band and to Axl. There is no telling what was planned and had to be scraped.
I have always thought the 2001 line up should have been reassembled before the release of the album. That's the line up that did 99% of the work. Since that wasn't happening, losing one more wasn't gonna make or break anything.
Re: Chinese Democracy Chart Positions Thread
buzzsaw wrote:First week sales were made 15 years ago for the most part. Add to that the fact that PJ hasn't exactly been setting the world on fire with their last few releases and I don't think it means anything. It's apples to oranges (like most things when compared to GnR).
Jarmo's doing what he always does - taking things out of context to make excuses for the band's failures. He's in such a hurry to defend them on something that there is no defense for. GnR had a guarantee of 200k in sales from internet idiots and sold nothing after the initial rush. You can't compare their first week sales to anyone else's fairly, but you can over time. Let's wait and compare the sales after a couple months to get a better feel for one compared against the other.
Fair enough. Would it be fair to revaluate this again in a few months. I can understand what you're saying and I'm just wondering if you think it'll be a fair comparison in a few months. Like maybe check back in Jan and see what Backspacer did from September to January and compare it to what CD did from November to March?
It will still be different to some extent, but the comparison will be more valid in my opinion.
Re: Chinese Democracy Chart Positions Thread
talk about making COMPLETELY ignorant assumptions. I laugh at the thought of a teenager even remotely knowing how a grown man feels about anything.
I meant I laughed at the image in my head of Axl going on reading Steph Seymoure divorce and then going into the corner to cry or something. It's a bit of a pathetic but humorous image.
I'm sorry but if Axl is still hung up on Seymour all these years later that is pathetic.
- monkeychow
- Rep: 661
Re: Chinese Democracy Chart Positions Thread
I could be putting way too much stock into what the band thinks of the forums, but since no one else talks about GNR these days, my guess is it's where the band gets it's idea of what "the public" thinks.
Yeah, that's the thing, as much as there's still the delays and a lot of negativity about, I sort of feel that sometimes things from these boards tend to happen, or events show that the band is listening sometimes.
Like when the myspace or someone's page says something dumb it gets pulled pretty fast after a thread on it often.
Or like in 2006 on eddie trunk Axl didn't have too much to say about Catcher, then we talked about how great it was, then it ends up with Ron re-doing the parts and on the album, and Axl specifically talks about it when he comes online.
Or like all the "there is no GNR, what band?" talk seemed to be very close to when DJ was announced too.
Or like how robin was universally flamed for the industrial look and Axl critizised for dressing like a rapper. Then robin shows up with long hair and a beard, and Axl back to classic rock.
Maybe its just co-incidence. Maybe not. In the end Axl does things his way, but I feel like he has been paying attention to what we say, even if he doesn't always jump on our commands.
Does make me think though. Immagine how "thick skinned" one would have to be to come on here and read the sort of opinions people post if it was dedicated to our own lives.
Also I think a lot of us here get into a 'devil's advocate' mode where even though we're big fans and have a ton of respect for the band rerally, we'll discuss or critizise them for the sake of debate. Just makes me wonder that's all.
No one ever thought he was trying to work something out with Robin, ala Buckethead up until the last minute?
I personally very much felt that. I dont have it handy - but I thought GNR's original comment on his departute was very diplomatic - something that expressed their surprise that he was gone but gave him a ton of breathing room to return.
Overall, I doubt robin's loss is a long term blow to the band. It survived the loss of Slash and of Bucket. But in terms of the CD release plan going off without a hitch - it would have been a massive spanner in the works!
- monkeychow
- Rep: 661
Re: Chinese Democracy Chart Positions Thread
madagas wrote:talk about making COMPLETELY ignorant assumptions. I laugh at the thought of a teenager even remotely knowing how a grown man feels about anything.
I meant I laughed at the image in my head of Axl going on reading Steph Seymoure divorce and then going into the corner to cry or something. It's a bit of a pathetic but humorous image.
I'm sorry but if Axl is still hung up on Seymour all these years later that is pathetic.
Firstly, some people have different characters to others, and for some people if you fell very deeply in love there's a part of you that never really recovers from that. Not most people but for some.
Secondly, it's an assumption that it was that thread that made him log off. Maybe the door bell rang...could be anything.
Thirdly, even if that thread DID make him log off. It could be because he went to the site to get inspired to tour, or see what the fans thought about the ashba announcment or some other GNR thing, and he saw a bunch of people talking about his Ex and he wasn't interested. If he wanted to talk about the band, and all he got was pages of people bitching about his ex girlfriend and making assumptions about two people they never met...well I can see myself changing the channel too.
Re: Chinese Democracy Chart Positions Thread
I think Robin's departure definitely could've hindered any pre and post release plans. I mean it's entirely possible that nothing would've happened any differently if he stuck around, we'll never know. But, IF he was around, irregardless if you think he's talented or sucks or whatever. He was a part of the band and had been working with Axl for nearly a decade. He was at least the #2 guitarist after Buckethead on the album, but was #1 with seniority. I think it'd be difficult to promote an album where your top 2 guitarists are no longer in the band. One you could almost get away with, at least Ron played on the album and toured with the band playing some of Buckethead's parts. But DJ wasn't even in the band at the time. The lineup was unsettled, not an ideal situation for a band that just released an album.
Not sure how that WOULDN'T mess things up a bit.
And I'm not too sure how much you can discount comparing PJ sales numbers to GNR. Granted CD sales seem to get worse with each passing day so they're worse now than they were in Nov. 08. And yes CD was billed as the "most anticipated album of all time" or whatever. But people are constantly saying how only the hardcores bought the album and they don't know anyone who actually owns the album. Last time I checked, Pearl Jam has a pretty large and loyal fanbase. I would've expected them to sell a little more. I hadn't bought a Pearl Jam album in 10 years or so and got this one because they offered 2 free concert downloads with the purchase of the album, one of which I attended. Plus it's a Target exclusive and there ARE more Target's out there than there are Best Buy's. So while I agree it isn't quite fair to put them on an equal level for comparison in week 1, I don't think it's THAT far off.
