You are not logged in. Please register or login.
- Topics: Active | Unanswered
- Communist China
- Rep: 130
Re: Norways 9/11
This is a horrible tragedy, but the focus on ideology of the attacker bothers me, just like it did in the Arizona shooting of Rep Giffords. Religious extremism is not a source for terrorism. The Amish are religious extremists. The Tibetan monks are religious extremists. Mother Theresa was a religious extremist. Once again, this is a case where some people who have committed terrible acts have been religious extremists (more often pretenders looking to exploit that centralized power) and people choose to ignore their motivation for more convenient narratives.
What I learned from 9/11 was that deceiving yourself doesn't work. 9/11 was a secular attack - listen to the reasons bin Laden lists for the attack, they're all secular. American support of Israel, funding of the World Bank and IMF, and intrusive foreign policy - nothing about our citizenry's moral standards. Domestic terrorism is a different animal, but again, religious extremism is at best a co-symptom of the same craziness that inspires such violent acts. But our government didn't think we could handle that explanation, so instead we got 2 or 3 years of being told it's a holy war against our way of life. We responded with bombings, invasions, and the stripping of our liberties and privacy - running up a huge national debt while scaring ourselves and the world shitless.
The worst thing you can do with terrorism is overreact to it, since it's only function is to provoke reaction from an enormously larger entity. Treat it as a criminal problem, deal with him like you're dealing with a mass murderer. But don't make him an enemy combatant, don't go to war to make yourself feel braver. We really screwed up post-9/11. Do better with yours, pleasPr
Re: Norways 9/11
As he acted alone from a minority so small there might not even be a minority, there's no one to go to war against. We can go to war with democracy, through education, but to go to war against one man (or ten) can't be done.
I know many seek inspiration from Britain and Spain from their attacks. Keep calm, carry on and don't stray of the path.
However, these men who carried out the attacks on 9/11 were far from secular or athiests. As were the London bombers.
Re: Norways 9/11
I actually agree with China (doesn't happen alot of these issues).
That post at the top as interesting as it is, is an incredible overreaction to the events in Oslo, and reminds me alot of the U.S. initial-reaction after 9/11.
Hopefully Norwegians won't lose TONS and TONS of rights like Americans did, all in the name of "safety".
And I also want to say that militia movements for disagreements over how the government should be run versus Neo-Nazi racial purity - are two different things.
Trust me DCK, the absolute LAST thing you're gonna want your country to do is rope anti-government people and their "ideologies" in with "extremism".
'Cause basically from that point forward - you have a dictatorship. Anybody who disagrees with how the government is run or might have a different interpretation over the constitution, will be roped in with religious nuts that think Jesus or Allah told them to murder children.
Capitalist pigs and big corporate fat cats will then use those philosophies to silence basically anyone who disagrees with them.
Timothy McVeigh was a punk ass, but not all "constitution defending gun nuts" are wrong.
In an ironic twist, with as 'pro-democracy', 'pro-law' as America carries itself, corporate/industrialism in America has such a stranglehold on policy, that the absolute only way Americans will ever enact true change, even if it's to abolish the Republican & Democratic parties - will be with a stone, gun or bomb.
All i'm saying, is you can't rope every single revolt into the same basket, otherwise Americans would've never stood up to British tyranny, the South would've never stood up to North stealing it's rights, the North would've never helped end slavery, the Native American indians would've never stood up to thieving white man, Jews wouldn't have stood up against Hitler, Blacks would've never gotten civil rights, women wouldn't have gotten equal protection under the law, etc. etc.
When you label everything "extremism", that's a REAL dangerous area to go into. Suddenly you'll have a world operating like "Escape From New York".
Re: Norways 9/11
This is his 1400 page compendium about his beliefs and ideas http://www.mediafire.com/?1khq2dp93obby2v
Lunatics video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ps2GWeng … r_embedded
Our country is very different than yours Axlin, but I won't turn your post away as wrong. Not yet anyway
Re: Norways 9/11
The worst thing you can do with terrorism is overreact to it, since it's only function is to provoke reaction from an enormously larger entity
That was a great post but I strongly disagree with the above statement. Don't have the time at the moment to elaborate but my position on terrorism is well known here.
On topic, this massacre is horrific. Straight out of a horror movie but worse. Haven't watched much news or read articles since this tragedy happened so I don't know all the details but I hope all those children did not suffer much before the psycho killed them. Hopefully it was instant or near instant death.
When I first heard of this, I knew we had Evo members there and I prayed for the safety of them and their families. Glad you guys are ok although I'm sure its not REALLY "ok" but you know what I mean.
Re: Norways 9/11
This is his 1400 page compendium about his beliefs and ideas http://www.mediafire.com/?1khq2dp93obby2v
Lunatics video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ps2GWeng … r_embedded
Our country is very different than yours Axlin, but I won't turn your post away as wrong. Not yet anyway
You know your country better than me, but I was taking into consideration that the very words you quoted, cited Oklahoma City, an in-country American tragedy as it's prime example in comparison to the events in Oslo.
So our countries can't be too different.
My only guess is that Norwegian terrorists don't have that American-born fear that not only will our cops shoot your ass dead, but also everyday citizens could have concealed weapons that will stop you from a killing spree.
I don't have my gun on me all the time (come on, it's not the Old West, I don't need it everyday), but if I did, I wouldn't hesistate if I got a safe shot that wouldn't harm by-standers.
Communist China wrote:The worst thing you can do with terrorism is overreact to it, since it's only function is to provoke reaction from an enormously larger entity
That was a great post but I strongly disagree with the above statement. Don't have the time at the moment to elaborate but my position on terrorism is well known here.
On topic, this massacre is horrific. Straight out of a horror movie but worse. Haven't watched much news or read articles since this tragedy happened so I don't know all the details but I hope all those children did not suffer much before the psycho killed them. Hopefully it was instant or near instant death.
When I first heard of this, I knew we had Evo members there and I prayed for the safety of them and their families. Glad you guys are ok although I'm sure its not REALLY "ok" but you know what I mean.
Listen I voted for Bush, and supported the War On Terror as much as any guy. I was happy to see Obama continue Bush's policies on the subject also. I also believe that America was a safer country post-9/11, and the world as a whole.
But you'd be absolutely crazy if you didn't admit that Airport Security alone, as well as cops and federal agents have greatly abused the rights of private citizens in the present day, all in the name of "protecting from terrorism".
A 95-year old wheelchair bound cancer patient really needs her diaper checked for bombs? A 6-year old little girl needs her privates felt up for weapons? If I touched a little girl there in ANY OTHER SITUATION in this country, i'd be in jail for so fuckin' long it wouldn't be funny.
Come the fuck on dude. Airport security checks should be greatly scaled back.
I'd rather Americans man the fuck up and stop being pussy about an event that happened a decade ago.
I haven't forgot 9/11, but the moment of the "24"-like Jack Bauer-isms are unnecessary IN America. That's why we pay cops. Let Sonny Crockett do the work now, we don't need all this hyper-paranoia anymore.
If another 9/11 happens, oh well. But we can't walk around in fear for fucking ever, in the name sake of "the terrorists". I say fuck that. Time to grow some fucking balls back in this country.
Re: Norways 9/11
I hope all those children did not suffer much before the psycho killed them. Hopefully it was instant or near instant death.
Long story short about what happened.
The gunman first planted a carbomb outside govn.building in downtown Oslo. Massive damage and 7 people killed.
Right after that, the gunman (dressed as a police) took the boat out to the island Utøya. At Utøya there were about 650 young people from the youth organization of the governing Labour Party gathered for an annual summercamp.
When the gunman got to the island he started to gather people together and said he was gonna inform them about the bombblast in downtown Oslo.
Then he started shooting people.
Since the only way to get to the island is by boat, the gunman walked around the small island for an hour and a half just randomly shooting everyone he came across, before the (real) police manage to get to the island and arrest him.
So the kids that survived lived through a living nightmare!
Seeing them on the news talking about is absolutely heartbreaking!
Re: Norways 9/11
Yes, it must have been horrifying!
In one of the newsfeed shot from a news-helicopter, you can actually see the gunman standing on the shore shooting people with dead bodies scattered around him.
The kids who survived are telling gruesome tales of running around the island trying to hide in bushes, climbing trees or hiding in caves along the shore of the island.
Many of the kids started to swim away from the island in the desperation of trying to escape the psycho! Some were picked up by nearby boats, some made it to the mainland, some are missing/drowned.
So for an hour and a half it was a living nightmare like right of one of those Japanese horror/snuff movies!
One survivor talked about hiding with a group of 15-20 kids, the gunman found their hideout and managed to talk them into standing up and that he was an actual policeman (maybe these kids hadn't actually seen the gunman), he then executed nearly all but 5 or 6 of them!
For us Norwegians, who are used a 100% peacefull and non-violent society where even the average-day policeman aren't allowed to carry a gun, these events have prolly not even sunk in yet. At least they haven't for me!
The word unbelievable, thosen't even begin to describe it!
Re: Norways 9/11
We're not that different, maybe more alike now than before, but our country will never, ever adopt your gun policies and using this as a way of "threatening" potential terrorists.
The planned event and execution of the disaster of the event have clear comparisons to Oklahoma, if not just on a technical side. He's from the same side of things, just a different type of neo nazi shit. He reminds me of many internet users, especially those who comments in newspaper articles or on youtube as people who are well read, just not well read on the right things - not being able to seperate far fetched ideas as well as conspiracy theories. It also reminds me of Hitlers use of symbolism to blame the jews for everything wrong about Europe in the 30's.
But even so, we are a 100% peaceful and non-violent society with extreme strict gun laws. This will not change.
It also gives me comfort as a well-read history buff to know we've been through tough times before. People speak of loosing our innocense and our society changing now. We took all that back after Nazi-Germany left our country. We've been through shit before, and more shit than what most ordinary people might imagine concerning WW2. It is a rude awakening to those who are less informed and naive enough to believe we are something else than what we are and have been in the past. We created our society out of the worst massacre the world has ever seen in WW2, I see absolutely no reason we won't do the same again. We got through five years of young men and women dying in huge numbers in our merchant fleet, at home, in the air and on the ground.
History will always repeat itself.
Our society will stand, and our society will not change. We will take it back, as we did after WW2.
