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Re: Elementary School Shooting in US
Cramer wrote:The status quo will do nothing quick.
Anybody who thinks this isn't a gun control issue should have their head examined.
Anybody that thinks gun control solves this needs to have their head examined.
So if we enacted gun laws that stopped the sale of guns that spray out 50 bullets at a time that would not make a difference?
If we enacted laws that required stricter mental health evaluation that wouldn't make a difference?
Surely even you could understand these simple ideas.
Re: Elementary School Shooting in US
Cramer wrote:buzzsaw wrote:Guns are too inbred into our society. They will never go away even if outlawed. Once you realize that, you realize why gun control will never change anything in the US.
You wouldn't say that shit if your kid didn't come home from school, I can guarantee your ass that right now.
Bullshit. Facts are facts and emotions don't change them.
"Facts."
Re: Elementary School Shooting in US
The gun didn't kill anybody without a person pulling the trigger. Undeniable fact that renders the rest of your gun control bullshit useless.
Some logic...
The mentally ill person could cause no harm if they didn't have a trigger to pull in the first place, much less one attached to an assault weapon.
What is more logical to address right now? Mental illness or their ridiculously easy access to firearms?
Perhaps you can point out the last time somebody with a knife walked into a movie theater and killed two dozen people in one swoop? Please...I'm all ears.
Re: Elementary School Shooting in US
If guns weren't here (everywhere) already, I would agree with you. They are here and too many of them to go away any time soon.
What a cowards argument. By all means lets defend the insanity of the status quo while little kids have their brains splattered all over the walls of their school. Is that what you like???
- monkeychow
- Rep: 661
Re: Elementary School Shooting in US
Killing with a gun is easy. It's even easier when nobody else has one.
Yet all the free guns laws didn't stop USA passing the patriot act and a bunch of anti-terror laws that overrode the actual civil rights it used to be famous for.
Allowing guns in your constitution is doing nothing except increasing the incidence of accidental deaths and maimings, and increasing the severity of an incident when a person goes violently nuts.
Re: Elementary School Shooting in US
Killing with a gun is easy. It's even easier when nobody else has one.
Yes and how many random attacks does Norway have? Please. We are armed to the max here, millions of guns, yet we can't stop these endless attacks. The right wing shitheads answer to this is "more guns" and no regulation. Idiots!
Again, we have people getting shot that are surrounded my highly trained men with guns. Ronald Reagan, surrounded by Secret Service men was still shot. Explain to me how arming everybody makes a difference?
Giffords was shot in public in one of the most pro gun states of this country. There is no doubt that people at that event were packing heat, yet some how nobody was able to defend her. Why is this?
Re: Elementary School Shooting in US
Anybody that thinks gun control solves this needs to have their head examined.
Anybody who doesn't think gun control is one common sense step in the right direction to preventing these things or at the very least lowering the number of casualties or incidents needs a punch in the dick.
Re: Elementary School Shooting in US
Yes and how many random attacks does Norway have? Please. We are armed to the max here, millions of guns, yet we can't stop these endless attacks. The right wing shitheads answer to this is "more guns" and no regulation. Idiots!
Not many, but we have a lot of guns. In Switzerland every male keeps a fully automatic at home. How many attacks do they have?
We have a lot of home invasions though.
Again, we have people getting shot that are surrounded my highly trained men with guns. Ronald Reagan, surrounded by Secret Service men was still shot. Explain to me how arming everybody makes a difference?
Giffords was shot in public in one of the most pro gun states of this country. There is no doubt that people at that event were packing heat, yet some how nobody was able to defend her. Why is this?
Because people are not super heroes. You make it sound like Loughner is still out there killing people. No, he got body tackled pretty fast by some people without guns.
How many does the Dimebag killer take with him if there aren't armed men not far from the scene? As to why it doesn't happen more often, well gee, these killers aren't that stupid. They at least have the sense to attack people in no gun zones like schools, churches and summer camps. Despite how much some of these dudes probably hate cops you are not going to see a police station assault any time soon for a reason.
Restricting guns only takes them out of the hands of regular citizens. If I really want one it's really just a matter of having a few hundred bucks or an active imagination. Of course a society is not going to be able to stop crazies from popping up. People die, it's the nature of things. There's been more people killed in cars just since this story broke. It's the prize you pay for the larger good.
Re: Elementary School Shooting in US
polluxlm wrote:Killing with a gun is easy. It's even easier when nobody else has one.
Yet all the free guns laws didn't stop USA passing the patriot act and a bunch of anti-terror laws that overrode the actual civil rights it used to be famous for.
Allowing guns in your constitution is doing nothing except increasing the incidence of accidental deaths and maimings, and increasing the severity of an incident when a person goes violently nuts.
Well, let's not pretend it was easy. It did take a second Pearl Harbor to even get it in writing. And you can be sure that the presence of guns plays a part in why the law is currently only being applied to poor brown people. If the fed was to go all german on you and start loading up the camp transports I'd expect that venture to have a significant cost.
Apart from that it's probably nice to be able to defend yourself if needed (us non Americans know little about that), and not feel like some slave waiting for the state to come fill a police report on your corpse, or press charges if you survive it (against you).
Re: Elementary School Shooting in US
The funny thing about the Giffords incident was that there were people in the crowd with guns. And one of them almost shot and killed a hero who was pulling people to safety.
I think we should avoid broad generalizations here. There are as many guns in the US as there are people, and the majority of crimes like this happen through the killer getting their guns through illegal means. The mall shooter stole his gun. This psycho child murderer stole his mothers weapons. A background check and stricter gun laws would not have stopped it, or the majority of mass shootings like this. Buzz is right that there's just too many guns out there. But this has nothing to do with being a "pussy" or not getting a trophy. We seriously need to reavaluate what we think of, understand and how we approach the mentally ill. It is a disease and is far more devastating than people think.
But there is nothing wrong with stricter gun laws: Stopping the sell of weapons over the internet or gun shows (at the very least impose a background check) etc. I lived in Florida where you had to wait three days to get your gun after purchase while they did a background check. I had no problem with that. If it saves one innocent life, that's good enough for me. Here in TN you can walk into a gunshop and walk out with a gun.
The majority of people who own guns don't have an incident with them. There have been cases of people protecting themselves from murderers and rapists by shooting and killing their attacker with their own gun. Their life means something too, right? I own a gun.
And we all know how dangerous alcohol is. Like a gun, alcohol can turn a simple argument into a tragedy. It can turn people violent. It can turn a car into a dangerous weapon. We don't outlaw booze, for one, we tried that and it didn't work. It made things worse. Second, if you want to live in a free society there are going to be tragedies because of the rights you have. But that doesn't mean you can't do what you can to curb them. But it always goes back to "what's going too far." I've heard people want to ban guns, but go crazy over the notion of getting rid of alcohol (which is their "thing") and want to legalize drugs across the board, despite the fact of the damage that will cause. Something to think about.
