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- Smoking Guns
- Rep: 330
Re: Elementary School Shooting in US
Should Europe get rid of all Muslims since some of them are terrorists and most terrorists are Muslim so that you don't have double decker buses blown up, or subways, or shoe bombers? I do think something needs to be done. It's too easy to obtain these weapons. Black on black crime in gun free areas like Chicago is at an all time high. It's a fucked up deal. It's either urban blacks or crazy ass white dudes. We got a gun problem. I admit it.
Re: Elementary School Shooting in US
I have no idea what people want us to do, or what the argument is.
1. Buzz nor I have said anything against strict gun laws. Matter of fact, we've both said pass them.
2. Banning guns will never happen. That's just reality. And you cannot compare the US to any other nation, not Australia or the whole of Europe, considering just the size, population and our political system that none of you seem to understand; some states in America have very strict gun laws, some cities have no violent crime, others have high violent crime. You are more likely to be struck by lightning than be a victim of gun violence.
3. There is more that goes into those stats - Such as the economics of high crime neighborhoods, unstable single parent homes, unsupervised kids growing into criminals leading to higher crime rates and gun violence, poor education systems, even to nutrition. Of course, that's not as easy, sexy or goes with any agenda than say, "ban all guns." Unfortunately, addressing these things have more impact than the strictest gun laws. Sorry.
4. Mass killings have a direct link to mental illness. Since no one wants to hear about it, and I've already pointed out that there is a system to deal with this, with psychological profiles that HAVE been identified and HAS stopped many mass shootings and serial klillers, I'll not say anymore... Except BAN GUNS!
5. There are a lot of misinformed, unrealistic and SNIDE remarks said in this thread about America, that exists, imo, outside the gun debate.
And when you start making comparisons to any other nation just remember, it's much easier to impose those gun bans considering the population and ammount of guns in circulation in those countries.
- monkeychow
- Rep: 661
Re: Elementary School Shooting in US
You make it sound like people are getting shot left and right. You guys think it's the wild west and that couldn't be further from the truth. You have this perception that is so far from reality and that keeps you from having any understanding of what is going on.
That makes you the ignorant ones.
So lets look at what goes on:
In the United States in 2009 United Nations statistics record 3.0 intentional homicides committed with a firearm per 100,000 inhabitants; for comparison, the figure for the United Kingdom, with where handguns are prohibited was 0.07 per 100,000, about 40 times lower, and for Germany 0.2.
But no...we're ignorant and don't understand how complex it all is? It's beyond comical that in that environment people are suggesting the solution is MORE guns and to arm people in public spaces.
- monkeychow
- Rep: 661
Re: Elementary School Shooting in US
I have no idea what people want us to do, or what the argument is.
1. Buzz nor I have said anything against strict gun laws. Matter of fact, we've both said pass them.
Buzz also spoke about how they don't work.
2. Banning guns will never happen. That's just reality.
Once upon a time it was also reality that a black man would never ride a bus with a white man. Sociological change happens when a society makes an effort to fix things that are blatantly wrong.
And you cannot compare the US to any other nation, not Australia or the whole of Europe, considering just the size, population and our political system that none of you seem to understand; some states in America have very strict gun laws, some cities have no violent crime, others have high violent crime. You are more likely to be struck by lightning than be a victim of gun violence.
Australia is a similar geographical size, Europe has just as many people, Japan's constitution was written by Americans, the UK founded your country...I love the USA as much as everyone...but in terms of western nations the only reason you are a special case is that you refuse to accept common sense on this issue...the differences you refer to are just reasons why the changeover would be long and hard...not why it shouldn't happen.
3. There is more that goes into those stats
Agreed...but the USA isn't the only country with poverty, single parents, and so on...but you are the nation with shameful gun violence stats. There's a reason why.
4. Mass killings have a direct link to mental illness.
Yes. But American's shouldn't be more crazy than the rest of the western countries that don't experience these incidents with anything near the frequency you do.
5. There are a lot of misinformed, unrealistic and SNIDE remarks said in this thread about America, that exists, imo, outside the gun debate.
Personally I love the USA...seriously...there's so much great stuff about your nation....but on this one issue you seem so crazy to the rest of the world and it frustrates us. It's like having an old grandfather who still hates japan after WW2....you can't seem to move on...the whole rest of the world can see the problem bleeding out on your street and yet as a nation you're stuck in childish rhetoric like "it's people not guns that kill people".
Re: Elementary School Shooting in US
buzzsaw wrote:You make it sound like people are getting shot left and right. You guys think it's the wild west and that couldn't be further from the truth. You have this perception that is so far from reality and that keeps you from having any understanding of what is going on.
That makes you the ignorant ones.
So lets look at what goes on:
In the United States in 2009 United Nations statistics record 3.0 intentional homicides committed with a firearm per 100,000 inhabitants; for comparison, the figure for the United Kingdom, with where handguns are prohibited was 0.07 per 100,000, about 40 times lower, and for Germany 0.2.
But no...we're ignorant and don't understand how complex it all is? It's beyond comical that in that environment people are suggesting the solution is MORE guns and to arm people in public spaces.
Of the stats you quote, how many of those are gang related? Bad guys shooting bad guys? Once you eliminate those, the numbers aren't going to be very different.
So no, you don't understand the complexity of the issue. That's not your fault; you don't live here. The fact remains that these mass shootings never happen in a place where there are a lot of guns. You can analyze why to death, but that is a fact.
Re: Elementary School Shooting in US
U guys are goin in circles....my US friends, ur insistance on a right to bear arms is ridiculous and outdated...ur right its not the wild west anymore, who needs more reminding? The folks in American urban areas with sidearms or non Americans? I like the USA, but in all honesty I always feels.safer when I get back on the Canadian side of the border...
To my non us friends, the arguments are falling on deaf ears, they either don't get it, or refuse to get it...or maybe the rest of the world doesn't know what we are talking about....
In any case u guys are going in circles 
I tell u one thing though, I saw on the news today that Utah is going to train teachers to carry firearms in elementary schools....that is fucked anyway u slice it, do we really feel.safe when our youth's caregivers need to carry weapons? Before you reply, seriously thinkk about the implications of this idea
Re: Elementary School Shooting in US
Arrogance has been tossed around this thread a lot, but this is SO ARROGANT and yes it is insulting, dude. No, you obviously do not know what you are talking about.
Monkey, you quoted my posts bit by bit, but ignored the most important aspects and only responded to things that fit your argument. There are over 350 million guns here already, unlike any other country in the world. YOU DON'T THINK WE SHOULD HAVE GUNS...... TOO BAD. They are not going to be banned. End of story. There are definitely ways to lower the numbers of gun violence but you ignore them. You ignore the reality of our situation to fit your opinions.
No, gun laws will not work without what I mentioned. You're talking about WHAT YOU WANT. We live in a country where every single individual has certain rights, which means something to US. There is a protocol. And we cannot simply ban something as easy as you can. It is clear you do not understand this fact.
And your "geographical comparisons" are ridiculous, as are your analogies, but it's a weak response to something you cannot answer. We deal with the reality of our situation HERE, not looking in from the outside in.
"Mass killings have a direct link to mental illness. Since no one wants to hear about it, and I've already pointed out that there is a system to deal with this, with psychological profiles that HAVE been identified and HAS stopped many mass shootings and serial klillers"
Since this was ignored.
Re: Elementary School Shooting in US
misterID wrote:That Utah thing is a proposition, not a law, and state houses make stupid propositions that go absolutely nowhere all the time.
Still not a good idea imho...
I don't think we disagree with you. I know I don't. But...
...the fact still remains that no mass shooting has ever taken place in the US anywhere where there are a lot of guns.
