You are not logged in. Please register or login.
- Topics: Active | Unanswered
Pages: 1
Re: Oct 31 1996
http://ultimateclassicrock.com/slash-qu … s-n-roses/
"LIVE!!!! From "Burning Hills", California...
Due to overwhelming enthusiasm, and that "DIVE IN AND FIND THE MONKEY" attitude....
#1. There will NOT be a Guns N' Roses tour.
#2. There will NOT be an official Guns N' Roses web site.
#3. There will NOT be any NEW Guns N' Roses videos.
#4. There will NOT be any new Guns N' Roses involved merhandise.
#5. There will NOT be a Guns N' Roses Fan Club.
#6. There will be a new Guns N' Roses 12 song minimum recording with
three original "B" sides.
NOTE: If all goes well this will be immediately repeated.
#7. However*******Slash will not be involved in any new Guns N' Roses
endeavors? as far has not been musically involved with Guns N" Roses
since April 1994 with the exception of a BRIEF feel period with Zakk
Wylde and a 2 week initial period with Guns N' Roses in the late fall
of '95. He (Slash) has been "OFFICIALLY and LEGALLY" outside of the
Guns N' Roses Partnership since December 31, 1995.
***************************************************
Nothing here is Subject To Change
Without A PERMANENT SUSPENSION
Of the "Pseudo Studio Musician Work Ethic"
SINCERELY,
W. Axl Rose
Big FD Ent., Inc.
Mike "Duff" McKagan"
What a load of fucking horseshit! I love it! "If all goes well.." oh god, that guy cracks me up.
Re: Oct 31 1996
http://ultimateclassicrock.com/slash-qu … s-n-roses/
"LIVE!!!! From "Burning Hills", California...
Due to overwhelming enthusiasm, and that "DIVE IN AND FIND THE MONKEY" attitude....
#1. There will NOT be a Guns N' Roses tour.
#2. There will NOT be an official Guns N' Roses web site.
#3. There will NOT be any NEW Guns N' Roses videos.
#4. There will NOT be any new Guns N' Roses involved merhandise.
#5. There will NOT be a Guns N' Roses Fan Club.
#6. There will be a new Guns N' Roses 12 song minimum recording with
three original "B" sides.NOTE: If all goes well this will be immediately repeated.
#7. However*******Slash will not be involved in any new Guns N' Roses
endeavors? as far has not been musically involved with Guns N" Roses
since April 1994 with the exception of a BRIEF feel period with Zakk
Wylde and a 2 week initial period with Guns N' Roses in the late fall
of '95. He (Slash) has been "OFFICIALLY and LEGALLY" outside of the
Guns N' Roses Partnership since December 31, 1995.***************************************************
Nothing here is Subject To Change
Without A PERMANENT SUSPENSION
Of the "Pseudo Studio Musician Work Ethic"SINCERELY,
W. Axl Rose
Big FD Ent., Inc.
Mike "Duff" McKagan"What a load of fucking horseshit! I love it! "If all goes well.." oh god, that guy cracks me up.
What on earth was going through his head...are there inside jokes in that press release? Did he write that on the side of a napkin?
Re: Oct 31 1996
What on earth was going through his head...
He was pissed that things failed to work out between Slash and the surrogate Izzy, Paul Tobias. Paul, Dizzy and others had written a bunch of songs to be used as a basis for the next album, all were Axl's employees, etc. He thought he'd had it covered - all it took was for Slash to play ball.
While we're on the subject of uncharted history, the '96 band may have convened at Yoda's place in Sedona, Phoenix, just before their implosion. Tom Zutaut has confirmed he made a similar trek with Axl in 2001, so it's certainly within the realm of possibility.
Suffice to say, Axl was pretty clueless about the atmosphere within his band most of the time, mainly because he failed to show up too much when the others were around. The end result was nigh 20 years of damage done. Too bad, but at least it's behind us now.
Re: Oct 31 1996
Reading that missive, I'd say there was a whole lot of snow going thru his head at the time. But that's the thing with Axl: with most anyone else you could say it was the coke, but with him.. well he just might be like that without the drugs.
I kind of miss angry Axl to be honest.
The fire's gone out..
How could he be clueless about the atmosphere within the band? I doubt that. I doubt it's even possible. Even when he wouldn't show up I'm sure he had sources whispering to him what was going on. Hell I can imagine him spying on the sessions with bugs & hidden cameras - except he prob was too distracted playing videogames with fernando to be bothered too much. He may have been aware, just incapable or ill-equipped to manage the band.
He alluded to this when asked about the Chinese-era lineups, didn't he? Where he said about he likes there to be tensions amongst the personalities & that atmosphere will reflect in the music..?? Something along those lines anyway.
If apex-twins analysis is correct however (& in fairness it usually is), then it is still bewildering & still mind blowing how the enterprise spiralled out of any semblance of normality when Slash wouldn't simply "play ball". Mind blowing how one piece/person caused the whole thing to effectively collapse*.
I can see that being the case, I'm just not sure I buy it 100%. But maybe it is a case of Occam's razor & I'm looking for complexities that didn't really exist, or were fabricated by the myth.
*Im not blaming Slash, rather the ill communication/breakdown of the Axl-Slash relationship. How losing Slash derailed the whole thing.
Funny that note about the "Psuedo Studio Musician Work Ethic". Duff explicitly details Axl's working hours as his reason for walking away. Can quite easily imagine Slash being pissed off for similar reasons while the other guys, like apex says, were all Axl's employees & obviously more willing to live on Axl time.
Which brings me back around to my point about missing angry Axl. Somewhere in the past decade Axl has been tamed & started living on a similar timetable as the rest of society..
Re: Oct 31 1996
Reading that missive, I'd say there was a whole lot of snow going thru his head at the time. But that's the thing with Axl: with most anyone else you could say it was the coke, but with him.. well he just might be like that without the drugs.
That's actually a real funny description. 
And it's true. Look at The Making of 'Don't Cry'. They're doing a video to a simple love song Axl and Izzy wrote years back. Now, Izzy's gone and Axl's going on and on about this character he's playing, some sort of mythical gunslinger. That and his preoccupation with death (camera diving underground, into his grave) and reincarnation. What in the blazes does all that have to do with the song?
What about November Rain? Axl marrying Stephanie Seymour on MTV, with her character effectively killing herself? Hardly self-aware stuff, otherwise Uncle Axl might've thought twice about displaying a relationship that was, effectively, dysfunctional and tragic. Further videos, Estranged and Since I Don't Have You, feature him as a character drifting further into his own world.
SIDHY is particularly interesting, when you consider that Axl's in trouble, Slash is on a boat trip with the Devil, Duff and Matt are enjoying the easy life, Gilby's cooking and Dizzy is trying to help Axl out, albeit poorly. Them band dynamics were laid out pretty bare in that, I'd say.
How could he be clueless about the atmosphere within the band?
We're obviously speculating, but I'll rephrase a bit.
Axl thought Paul was the right guy for the Izzy role. Gilby was given the boot so that Paul could come in. In retrospect, smart money would've kept Gilby on retainer as a live player to accommodate Slash. Axl practically threw Paul at them and told them to get busy. Slash and Duff both told him they thought Paul was simply a bad fit to the unit. Axl's boy from Indiana, possibly a teetotaler, zero experience on big bands and on Guns. This was hardly someone like West Arkeen, a proven collaborator and a familiar face.
In any case, Axl appeared perplexed by the issues. I'm sure that in his head, it had all worked out. He likely would've given it a lot of thought and reached a conclusion that it. Will. Work. Then, when the boys come to him with the bad news, he wonders what is their major malfunction. I'm saying Axl seems to get so doggedly convinced about some of his ideas that he's regularly felt alienated and misunderstood by the people around him whenever there's a dissonance between his theory and the outside environment. This is his problem obviously. He could've phoned up Slash and Duff and ask whether they'd like to jam with his personal writing partner, to see if they, too, could benefit from him. Nay, he was a mastermind without a reality check or a safety valve.
Steve Jobs had this thing called a Reality distortion field.
The RDF was said by Andy Hertzfeld to be Steve Jobs's ability to convince himself and others to believe almost anything with a mix of charm, charisma, bravado, hyperbole, marketing, appeasement and persistence. RDF was said to distort an audience's sense of proportion and scales of difficulties and made them believe that the task at hand was possible.
When you the biggest rock band in the world and remain entrenched in yes men, you'll write your own press releases and believe them. Everybody was too scared to tell him otherwise, because he'd fly off the handle and fire them in a heartbeat. Working for him was probably stressful for many. A well-paid job, but tenuous as hell, as you'd never know when the boss would get mad at someone, and next month's rent is still due. So, you'd have a bunch of strung-out yes men expanding his reality distortion field. Beyond that field would've been the band.
Even when he wouldn't show up I'm sure he had sources whispering to him what was going on.
But they were led by Doug Goldstein. Most were unreliable narrators.
He may have been aware, just incapable or ill-equipped to manage the band.
He alluded to this when asked about the Chinese-era lineups, didn't he? Where he said about he likes there to be tensions amongst the personalities & that atmosphere will reflect in the music..?? Something along those lines anyway.
Yup, he's mentioned them as 'opinionated' and other things. But Ron had a terrible run in 2006 and was essentially bullied since Day 1. It was essentially Paul Huge revisited; the unwanted addition by the runaway boss. Axl, apparently, thought he could ascend all the interpersonal conflicts and focus solely on the music by putting all the guys on the payroll and listening to freshly-burned discs in his mansion. Because he was daunted by the circumstances his theories had led him and the band into.
it is still bewildering & still mind blowing how the enterprise spiralled out of any semblance of normality when Slash wouldn't simply "play ball". Mind blowing how one piece/person caused the whole thing to effectively collapse*.
Slash leaving Guns cut Axl deep and deflated his sense of creative security. It also ruined all chances to have a functional and productive band despite Axl. Hardly the single thing, rather than the final straw on the camel's back. Izzy was gone, Duff was thinking about his options. But Slash was the first mate - it's hard to imagine one without the other when considering the historical merits of Guns.
Which brings me back around to my point about missing angry Axl. Somewhere in the past decade Axl has been tamed & started living on a similar timetable as the rest of society..
I blame CD's reception and the apparent soul-searching / depression / boozing that followed.
Re: Oct 31 1996
johndivney wrote:Reading that missive, I'd say there was a whole lot of snow going thru his head at the time. But that's the thing with Axl: with most anyone else you could say it was the coke, but with him.. well he just might be like that without the drugs.
That's actually a real funny description.
And it's true. Look at The Making of 'Don't Cry'. They're doing a video to a simple love song Axl and Izzy wrote years back. Now, Izzy's gone and Axl's going on and on about this character he's playing, some sort of mythical gunslinger. That and his preoccupation with death (camera diving underground, into his grave) and reincarnation. What in the blazes does all that have to do with the song?
What about November Rain? Axl marrying Stephanie Seymour on MTV, with her character effectively killing herself? Hardly self-aware stuff, otherwise Uncle Axl might've thought twice about displaying a relationship that was, effectively, dysfunctional and tragic. Further videos, Estranged and Since I Don't Have You, feature him as a character drifting further into his own world.
SIDHY is particularly interesting, when you consider that Axl's in trouble, Slash is on a boat trip with the Devil, Duff and Matt are enjoying the easy life, Gilby's cooking and Dizzy is trying to help Axl out, albeit poorly. Them band dynamics were laid out pretty bare in that, I'd say.
johndivney wrote:How could he be clueless about the atmosphere within the band?
We're obviously speculating, but I'll rephrase a bit.
Axl thought Paul was the right guy for the Izzy role. Gilby was given the boot so that Paul could come in. In retrospect, smart money would've kept Gilby on retainer as a live player to accommodate Slash. Axl practically threw Paul at them and told them to get busy. Slash and Duff both told him they thought Paul was simply a bad fit to the unit. Axl's boy from Indiana, possibly a teetotaler, zero experience on big bands and on Guns. This was hardly someone like West Arkeen, a proven collaborator and a familiar face.
In any case, Axl appeared perplexed by the issues. I'm sure that in his head, it had all worked out. He likely would've given it a lot of thought and reached a conclusion that it. Will. Work. Then, when the boys come to him with the bad news, he wonders what is their major malfunction. I'm saying Axl seems to get so doggedly convinced about some of his ideas that he's regularly felt alienated and misunderstood by the people around him whenever there's a dissonance between his theory and the outside environment. This is his problem obviously. He could've phoned up Slash and Duff and ask whether they'd like to jam with his personal writing partner, to see if they, too, could benefit from him. Nay, he was a mastermind without a reality check or a safety valve.
Steve Jobs had this thing called a Reality distortion field.
The RDF was said by Andy Hertzfeld to be Steve Jobs's ability to convince himself and others to believe almost anything with a mix of charm, charisma, bravado, hyperbole, marketing, appeasement and persistence. RDF was said to distort an audience's sense of proportion and scales of difficulties and made them believe that the task at hand was possible.
When you the biggest rock band in the world and remain entrenched in yes men, you'll write your own press releases and believe them. Everybody was too scared to tell him otherwise, because he'd fly off the handle and fire them in a heartbeat. Working for him was probably stressful for many. A well-paid job, but tenuous as hell, as you'd never know when the boss would get mad at someone, and next month's rent is still due. So, you'd have a bunch of strung-out yes men expanding his reality distortion field. Beyond that field would've been the band.
johndivney wrote:Even when he wouldn't show up I'm sure he had sources whispering to him what was going on.
But they were led by Doug Goldstein. Most were unreliable narrators.
johndivney wrote:He may have been aware, just incapable or ill-equipped to manage the band.
He alluded to this when asked about the Chinese-era lineups, didn't he? Where he said about he likes there to be tensions amongst the personalities & that atmosphere will reflect in the music..?? Something along those lines anyway.Yup, he's mentioned them as 'opinionated' and other things. But Ron had a terrible run in 2006 and was essentially bullied since Day 1. It was essentially Paul Huge revisited; the unwanted addition by the runaway boss. Axl, apparently, thought he could ascend all the interpersonal conflicts and focus solely on the music by putting all the guys on the payroll and listening to freshly-burned discs in his mansion. Because he was daunted by the circumstances his theories had led him and the band into.
johndivney wrote:it is still bewildering & still mind blowing how the enterprise spiralled out of any semblance of normality when Slash wouldn't simply "play ball". Mind blowing how one piece/person caused the whole thing to effectively collapse*.
Slash leaving Guns cut Axl deep and deflated his sense of creative security. It also ruined all chances to have a functional and productive band despite Axl. Hardly the single thing, rather than the final straw on the camel's back. Izzy was gone, Duff was thinking about his options. But Slash was the first mate - it's hard to imagine one without the other when considering the historical merits of Guns.
johndivney wrote:Which brings me back around to my point about missing angry Axl. Somewhere in the past decade Axl has been tamed & started living on a similar timetable as the rest of society..
I blame CD's reception and the apparent soul-searching / depression / boozing that followed.
Damn dude...this is like a dissertation. Really nice insight....you clearly spent a lot of time on this....
Apex....interesting stuff there too...
Might need another day or two to fully break this down...in the end, sounds like a lead singer syndrome of some sort....
It's kinda crazy...that the same typical problems that year people apart in relationships - even as petty as petty can get....It can tear down the most impressive of empires.
- TheSundanceKid
- Rep: 30
Re: Oct 31 1996
I don't think Paul "Huge" Tobias was that foreign to the members of Guns N' Roses after all he and Axl co-wrote Back off Bitch and clearly they must have hanged out during Guns big run.
Re: Oct 31 1996
That press release is bat shit crazy in hindsight. He had no idea what he was really doing at that point and was just making it up as he went along. Hard to believe us hardcores were a tad optimistic then. Never could have imagined that the next 20 years would turn out how they did....one song....live cds.....leaks.....one album....off and on touring mainly focusing on their debut album.....then a modern day UYI reunion that may or may not focus on moving forward with new material.
The AC/DC thing potentially complicates the situation even more. That run could easily be extended. Funny how people said Slash could never multitask so a reunion wouldn't be possible when it winds up being Axl the one who is multitasking.
Pages: 1
