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- monkeychow
- Rep: 661
Re: The Creative Crisis of Guns N' Roses
yeah there was a lot of buzz when Axl did trunk in 2006 then those hammerstein shows launching the tour....if they'd dropped the album mid way through that when the band was looking and sounding good (well as good as it can sound with robin not slash lol) then I think things would have been different. But a futher 2 year wait and then a promo less announcement. WTF is that. Obviously someone made Axl mad at the label so he decided to punish himself....
- dalethirsty
- Rep: 20
Re: The Creative Crisis of Guns N' Roses
I still cant believe there's not one single photograph of the 2000-02 lineups in existence. Just pure insanity. It really shows how it wasn't being taken seriously by any involved, top to bottom, even if just subconsciously. The "new" GNR lineups that were supposed to do all this moving on never became a reality. It was just an idea...a concept....a "vision"....and it never truly went anywhere.
Yeah I know...they toured the world...he kicked ass....that's not the point.
It never existed. Hardcore fans knew of the Bucketnoses and Bumblearms but they didn't exist to the general public. People would just show up to hear some hits, go home, and never think about it again because everything stayed under the radar.
axl's self-consciousness projected itself onto the entire band. back in 02', when he started rambling onstage about being the fuckin' serpico, it was clear that the weight of the gnr cross was too heavy for his weak ankles to carry.
a sane man would have taken buckethead and turned him into a household name. he was ready, brother. i love finck, but there's no reason they both had to be on lead alongside bucket. that was a mistake from the start.
like you said, it's unreal that we never had a pic of the entire "band" together. funnily enough, the best piece of media press the ever had was mtv's coverage of the tacoma 2002 show.
tommy and dizzy were sitting with loder like actual members of the band, they showed clips of new music being performed, bucket was being classic bucket... if only axl was ready to give this band an actual shot. instead, he half-assed his own performance and made non-stop excuses until the whole thing blew up.
sometimes i think he should have just dropped the gnr name and come back with his debut solo album. without the shackles of the band's legacy, he could have become a zappa, captain beefheart or trent reznor type character, who shifted band members around every few years to tackle new sounds and ideas. in this made-up universe, we could have had the beaven album, a bucket & brain album, and whatever axl hand in mind for the final installment of the trilogy. maybe this was the plan at some point, but the label & contracts prevented him from executing on his grand vision.
in any case, when it comes to new or unreleased music, speculation is probably all the fun we have left... sadly.
Re: The Creative Crisis of Guns N' Roses
I feel like Axl is kinda venturing off into that ecclectic, Liberace/Elvis post-fame mode.
he's pretty much doing it since Robin left the band... the so-called Ashba era was just endless touring without even a hint of any progression.
Re: The Creative Crisis of Guns N' Roses
tommy and dizzy were sitting with loder like actual members of the band, they showed clips of new music being performed, bucket was being classic bucket... if only axl was ready to give this band an actual shot. instead, he half-assed his own performance and made non-stop excuses until the whole thing blew up.
GREAT video. Watching it in hindsight is crazy....and sad. Who knew we had six more years of limbo before it would come out....and its release would be a popcorn fart in comparison to how it should've been.
The label should've just tossed it out there. Yeah I know they didn't consider it GNR and were against it but holy hell....just throw it at the wall and maybe something would've stuck.
That's what pisses me off the most about the saga. He wanted to unload it in 2001. They balked.
Once the 2002 implosion happened, he should've walked away from Chinese. It was quickly becoming an albatross. Its saga defined the second half of his career. Its not worthy of such distinction. While it may come across like a bad dream now....it shouldn't be the swan song of his discography.
Re: The Creative Crisis of Guns N' Roses
Once the 2002 implosion happened, he should've walked away from Chinese. It was quickly becoming an albatross. Its saga defined the second half of his career. Its not worthy of such distinction. While it may come across like a bad dream now....it shouldn't be the swan song of his discography.
If Axl wanted his career and the "Chinese Democracy" project to survive, he should've decoupled it from the Guns N' Roses brand.
The problem is he like all the greats are filled with objectively delusional self-belief and cut-throat ambition. It's how they can get to such great heights in the first place and what allows them to survive and overcome grueling stretches of touring and mental and physical anguish. Axl also lacks any sort of formal training in professional matters and even consistently told the professionals to go fuck themselves.
So going along with your premise, if he walks away from his two album opus, a near miraculous event, where does he walk to? Back to a label that had already lost interest, to his arthouse band comporting to be one of the biggest bands in history, or to the public with record lows of popularity?
The only thing he could walk back to is right where he came from.
In the end, it was doomed from the start.
- monkeychow
- Rep: 661
Re: The Creative Crisis of Guns N' Roses
Axl's swan song will be Ac/Dc's retirement album next year I recon.
Re: The Creative Crisis of Guns N' Roses
James Lofton wrote:Once the 2002 implosion happened, he should've walked away from Chinese. It was quickly becoming an albatross. Its saga defined the second half of his career. Its not worthy of such distinction. While it may come across like a bad dream now....it shouldn't be the swan song of his discography.
If Axl wanted his career and the "Chinese Democracy" project to survive, he should've decoupled it from the Guns N' Roses brand.
The problem is he like all the greats are filled with objectively delusional self-belief and cut-throat ambition. It's how they can get to such great heights in the first place and what allows them to survive and overcome grueling stretches of touring and mental and physical anguish. Axl also lacks any sort of formal training in professional matters and even consistently told the professionals to go fuck themselves.
So going along with your premise, if he walks away from his two album opus, a near miraculous event, where does he walk to? Back to a label that had already lost interest, to his arthouse band comporting to be one of the biggest bands in history, or to the public with record lows of popularity?
The only thing he could walk back to is right where he came from.
In the end, it was doomed from the start.
true. and I don't really think that 2002 was like "the peak" of ChiDem era and subsequent years were "mocking it" or something, no. there just were multiple iterations of ChiDem, we can call it "eras" - the origins like 1998-2000, we can safely call this 2000 Intentions Era. then Bucket era, then 2006-2008 era, then 2009-2014 era.
as for the rest, yeah Zilla, exactly as you said. too complicated and ambitious, too much mental tensions and disrespect to other people, and it was al doomed from the start.
- tejastech08
- Rep: 194
Re: The Creative Crisis of Guns N' Roses
Axl's swan song will be Ac/Dc's retirement album next year I recon.
If that is the case, I hope he knocks it out of the park. 
