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Re: Song #2 (Prostitute) is the biggest gun of all IMO
"Lips of an Angel" did reach #3 on the charts, but I consider that a ballad, nothing hard about that song. I agree a ballad can chart well (top 10), but as good as I think Shackler's is I don't think it can crack that level. If someone can show me a HARD rocking song that has, then I'll hold out some hope.
Back to Song 2, I know a lot of people hate the song but it has grown on me. I like it, though I like all the leaks. And I don't think it's "Prostitute", though what do I know?
Re: Song #2 (Prostitute) is the biggest gun of all IMO
I can't believe that people aren't going GAGA over Prostitute. On first listen, I liked the feel, but hadn't quite absorbed the full impact. As usual, my enjoyment of Axl's work easily multiplies obscenly when I work out the lyrics and listen to the music in the context of what Axl is saying - and in this particular case - this applies ridiculously. Along with 'Better', 'There Was A Time', 'Chinese Democracy', and 'Madagascar' - this is now EASILY one of (wait for it ) best GN'R (Yes, I said it) songs EVER made.
Naysayers - don't bitch me out, just look up or work out the lyrics and listen to the thing in CONTEXT.
Words & Music, folks.
Re: Song #2 (Prostitute) is the biggest gun of all IMO
Now that I've actually READ all the posts - I just wanted to say something about the whole Axl/Slash debate thing. It's a FACT (as in documented, more or less) that Slash quit the band because Axl wanted to go in various new directions. I for one, initially had my doubts - I wanted an asshole, and I didn't know who it was - and let's face it - Axl's an easy one to pin the asshole label on. As time went on, and no Gn'R material came out, I was seriously in need of a shot of whatever it was that I got out of Gn'R - so I bought and listened to just about everything Slash made or was on - and nothing, nothing - nada zilch. I mean - sure if you're just looking for good rock, etc - it was that, but it was just that. It was generic, maybe good - but overall fairly generic. I personally LIKE hearing something I've never heard before, and Slash was not providing me with that, and therefore - the tracks were all forgetable to me, same applies double to all the Velvet Revolver.
I WANTED to like the material. I TRIED to like it - No cigar.
I went out and hunted down the Izzy Stradlin' material - and I love Izzy, but again - the songs were good, but none of them had that 'holy shit, i can't believe this song is this good' feel that I got from the best GN'R work.
It's kind of about the music, and I love that Axl wanted to vary his sound, and it's kind of about the words, because - by god - Axl plumbs a lyrical mine that I personally resonate to very strongly - he is quite easily at his best with brain-shape songs - songs that are almost psychological examinations, introspective voyages through mind-fucked terrain.
But more so - it's about the words AND the music - it's how the song moves and shapes to mold the particular sentences into angry, wrathful, hopeful, desolate, loving, painful, pangs of meaning.
In cinematic terms - it's almost as though Axl were the film director and Slash was an actor - and without direction, he is devoid of meaningful context - and I know this may bring flames - but Weiland (am I even spelling it right) cannot provide the kind of context that I'm talking about here.
Axl gave Slash a context in which he could do the best work Slash has ever, ever, done. In the context of Axl's songs, and with the emotional thrust and depth that Axl's lyrics and melodies provided - Slash was magical. Truly magical. I have no doubt in my mind that the guitar parts in Estranged could not have been pulled off by ANYBODY else - and I don't mean that from a technical standpoint. Axl himself suspected this - which is why he specifically thanked Slash for his work on Estranged in UYI II's CD insert.
Axl's no fool, he knows damn well he provided the context, but he also knows that what Slash pulled off within that context was magic, soul-searing magic.
And I know for a fact, and history has demonstrated that Slash cannot travel that valley without Axl there to lead him across it.
And so here we are today - deal with the facts. Slash is NOT a member of GN'R - and I believe the work he did with Gn'R will remain unmatched unless he unites with somebody else who can provide him with the calibre of direction and vision and the depth of feel and meaning that Axl provided for him. People who are used to that particular combination will always feel betrayed almost by the fact that this particular coupling no longer exists - tough shit. I for one no longer cherish the guitar solo in and of itself. I am much more interested in songs as a whole, and when a song gives me the kind of emotional and lyrical rush that I can get from the likes of Better, Prostitute, etc - I don't go around wondering where the guitar solo is - and whether Slash might've/could've/would've played it better.
I just love some of the new stuff.
Some tracks, I still haven't quite made up my mind about, namely Shackler's Revenge and Rhiads & Bedouins (and I hope it isn't about what I'm thinking it's about)...but overall - in my mind - Axl is back, and is back with a vengeance, and I'll buy whatever that guy throws onto a cd 
Re: Song #2 (Prostitute) is the biggest gun of all IMO
Now that I've actually READ all the posts - I just wanted to say something about the whole Axl/Slash debate thing. It's a FACT (as in documented, more or less) that Slash quit the band because Axl wanted to go in various new directions.
wrong...read slash's book...they were at a point where they could no longer work together, they were of different minds on nearly everything
slash even addresses the creative differences thing in his book
In cinematic terms - it's almost as though Axl were the film director and Slash was an actor - and without direction, he is devoid of meaningful context
well the "director", as you put it, should maybe wrap up filming and put the movie out already..Slash is who he is and he lives to make all kinda of music, anything to keep busy...Slash would be dead if he was still with GnR, 14 years with nothing? my god the man cant stop playing music for a year let alone 14, check out his discography on the right side of the page..its insane..now compare it to axl's....and dont give me the quality over quantitiy bit either
Axl gave Slash a context in which he could do the best work Slash has ever, ever, done. In the context of Axl's songs, and with the emotional thrust and depth that Axl's lyrics and melodies provided - Slash was magical. Truly magical. I have no doubt in my mind that the guitar parts in Estranged could not have been pulled off by ANYBODY else - and I don't mean that from a technical standpoint. Axl himself suspected this - which is why he specifically thanked Slash for his work on Estranged in UYI II's CD insert.
Axl's no fool, he knows damn well he provided the context, but he also knows that what Slash pulled off within that context was magic, soul-searing magic.
And I know for a fact, and history has demonstrated that Slash cannot travel that valley without Axl there to lead him across it.
you make it sound like Axl made Slash...well what is the quality of Axl's work post slash? nothing we have heard so far rivals the all time great gnr tracks....like people said most of it is comparable the dregs of the UYI's....the magic was a 2 way street...alot of peopel feel that axl and slash were a match made in heaven...like musical soul mates if you will
axl hasnt exactly crossed a crack in hte sidewalk let alone a valley since slash left
And so here we are today - deal with the facts. Slash is NOT a member of GN'R
i dont think anyone here is debating that fact at all...we all know who is in GnR at the moment....(for the most part 
ie brain and robin)
I just love some of the new stuff.
Some tracks, I still haven't quite made up my mind about, namely Shackler's Revenge and Rhiads & Bedouins
rhaid and shacklers are cool by me...this track #2...which i still say is NOT prostitute...but whatever.....but it has defiantely grown on me....its got a cool vibe....anyway my general likes and dislikes of the material seem to be different form most people...IRS, TWAT and Maddy are my favs by far
Axl is back, and is back with a vengeance, and I'll buy whatever that guy throws onto a cd ;
its still kinda up in the air on whether he is back or not...lets not count our chicken dinners yet but i agree anything he releases i'll be buying
welcome to the board righter...good post 
EDIT: alot of people think i'm too pro slash and anti axl...its not the case...but when people are constantly down on slash i shake my head, the man is a musical icon who has managed to stay relevant and release music for 20-odd years....its amazing to me that pepople who are apparently fans of this band always find a way to run down one of the peopel who is responsible for every ounce of greatness that came out of that magically incredible 7 or so years that they were together...and it is amazing that these guys are still alive and its amazing they lasted 7 years together....does noone remember the constant controversy back then?
- monkeychow
- Rep: 661
Re: Song #2 (Prostitute) is the biggest gun of all IMO
Great Post Neemo...agree 100%
Re: Song #2 (Prostitute) is the biggest gun of all IMO
"Lips of an Angel" did reach #3 on the charts, but I consider that a ballad, nothing hard about that song. I agree a ballad can chart well (top 10), but as good as I think Shackler's is I don't think it can crack that level. If someone can show me a HARD rocking song that has, then I'll hold out some hope.
Back to Song 2, I know a lot of people hate the song but it has grown on me. I like it, though I like all the leaks. And I don't think it's "Prostitute", though what do I know?
*COUGHcheckmateCOUGH*
Re: Song #2 (Prostitute) is the biggest gun of all IMO
I haven't heard any of the new leaks,do they sound cool?
Re: Song #2 (Prostitute) is the biggest gun of all IMO
well the "director", as you put it, should maybe wrap up filming and put the movie out already..
Amen to that 
Slash is who he is and he lives to make all kinda of music, anything to keep busy...Slash would be dead if he was still with GnR, 14 years with nothing? my god the man cant stop playing music for a year let alone 14, check out his discography on the right side of the page..its insane..now compare it to axl's....and dont give me the quality over quantitiy bit either
Er..Why not ? I'm sorry, but I HAVE to give you the quality vs. quantity 'bit' - simply because it's true. You seem to think I'm a Slash-Basher of some sort I'm not. I loved the guys work with Gn'R - and I went out and listened to just about everything else he touched hoping to hear something half as good, but it all came out short 
Maybe that's just an isolated opinion that nobody else shares.
If you've heard anything by Slash (post-Gn'R) that compares to his Gn'R work, then please point me at it I'm telling you - I've heard the stuff, it's just not that good. I can phrase this in more subjective terms and just say 'It didn't really do it for me' - but I'd be half-lying. The fact is - I simply don't think it's that good. On the other hand, even the little bits and pieces that we've heard from Axl through the leaks have sounded a million times more interesting to me.
you make it sound like Axl made Slash...well what is the quality of Axl's work post slash? nothing we have heard so far rivals the all time great gnr tracks....like people said most of it is comparable the dregs of the UYI's....the magic was a 2 way street...alot of peopel feel that axl and slash were a match made in heaven...like musical soul mates if you will
axl hasnt exactly crossed a crack in hte sidewalk let alone a valley since slash left
I have to disagree
First of all - I didn't mean to imply that Axl MADE Slash, and I think if you read my post again with a slightly calmer mindset - you might see that What I said, and implied is that Axl provided a foundation and a vision that gave Slash the space to really shine and transcend some basic limits. That Slash is a good quitarist has never been in doubt, but it takes more than a good guitar solo to make something that's truly beautiful - it takes context, and meaning, and a dramatic direction that lends gravity and weight - so that those notes MEAN something. The more I hear of their respective materials, the more I'm convinced that Axl was mostly responsible for creating that context.
As for Axl's post-Slash work, I'm in AWE of 'Better' and 'Prostitute' and I do think (blasphemy!) that they ARE in fact quite comparable to the UYI materials. Of course, it's too early to judge their long term appeal since we've had UYI for years now...but only time can determine that particular bit...
rhaid and shacklers are cool by me...this track #2...which i still say is NOT prostitute...but whatever.....but it has defiantely grown on me....its got a cool vibe....anyway my general likes and dislikes of the material seem to be different form most people...IRS, TWAT and Maddy are my favs by far
Well, it may or may not be Prostitute - But by theme and lyrics alone, I'm willing to go along with that nomer until proven otherwise And I'm totally with you on TWAT and Maddy, but I.R.S. still hasn't struck a chord with me.
welcome to the board righter...good post
Thanks Good to know civil disagreements are possible around here It's much more fun than mud-slinging
EDIT: alot of people think i'm too pro slash and anti axl...its not the case...but when people are constantly down on slash i shake my head, the man is a musical icon who has managed to stay relevant and release music for 20-odd years....its amazing to me that pepople who are apparently fans of this band always find a way to run down one of the peopel who is responsible for every ounce of greatness that came out of that magically incredible 7 or so years
I am TOTALLY not trying to run down Slash. The work he's done with Gn'R is absolutely untouched in my mind. I'm just - yes - I'll say it - disappointed - with his post Gn'R work. Is that a sin ?
