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Re: Information on Shackler's Revenge
Yep. But Axl had no faith in his own material.
And where do you get this from? I have never found anything saying he doesn't have "faith" in his material. There is shit that us as fans will never know about this album and why it's not released yet.
Re: Information on Shackler's Revenge
He didn't say that, but he has been critical of the 2002 VMA appearence, and those close have alluded to the fact that he thought Oh My God was this stellar track, even in demo form, and of course it was met with large negative reviews. Silkworms at Rio III was also met with harsh criticism.
Axl has also said countless times about "i'm not gonna release it until I think it's ready".
To me, considering the fact that this album has been in the works for nearly a decade and isn't any closer to release than it was then, and that fact that the statement above has come out of Axl's mouth, leads me to believe that he just simply doesn't feel it's good enough. And he might be holding a masterpiece. But in his mind he's so sensitive to what people will think, that he keeps going over it and over it and over it, and never releasing it.
But you might take something different from that statement. I think I would too, IF the album had only been the works for a few years. But we both know it hasn't, and producers on the project have said stuff like "we had a finished album in 1999", "we had a finished album in 2001", "we had a finished album in 2003", "we had a finished album in 2006", etc.
How many years have 'finishing touches' been put on the album? That's not a sign of an artist who's confident in his material.
And James, I still think there's a chance that Shackler could be promoted with Rock Band 2 for later platforms & the holiday season - IF - the album is on the way.
- Captain Winkler
- Rep: -17
Re: Information on Shackler's Revenge
He didn't say that, but he has been critical of the 2002 VMA appearence, and those close have alluded to the fact that he thought Oh My God was this stellar track, even in demo form, and of course it was met with large negative reviews. Silkworms at Rio III was also met with harsh criticism.
the majority of your post was theory craft, based on unsubstantiated "i remember when" claims, but i am posting because i am adamant that silkworms was written by dizzy reed and chris pitman, Axl says that prior to the performance of the song at rock in rio.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZzfwjPHUdLk
there is the link to him saying who it was written by before the silkworms performance, so don't pin that dreadful song on axl. there was also a negative stigma surrounding axl(and still is) after the initial breakup of the band, which could be attributed to the largely negative reviews of Oh my god. the song itself although sloppy and under produced is actually pretty badass, imo.
Re: Information on Shackler's Revenge
It's "sloppy" in a White Zombie sort of way, which is what makes it so badass. Shackler's Revenge is like the long-lost brother of Oh My God. Both sound like they were conceived/recorded around the same time, but this Shackler's seems to have an additional luster added in production to "correct" that same sludgy sound that was met so harshly with Oh My God. It's really too bad. I've been a fan of Oh My God since the get-go and was apparently one of the few people not let down by the first new GN'R material to be heard (even at that point) in years. The two songs are so stylistically similar. It's the production, or rather the final mixes released of each, that are their only distinct difference. That and Oh My God sounds like a Robin Finck number re-recorded to not sound like a Robin Finck number and Shackler's sounds like a Buckethead number straight up.
- Mikkamakka
- Rep: 217
Re: Information on Shackler's Revenge
Axlin08 wrote:He didn't say that, but he has been critical of the 2002 VMA appearence, and those close have alluded to the fact that he thought Oh My God was this stellar track, even in demo form, and of course it was met with large negative reviews. Silkworms at Rio III was also met with harsh criticism.
the majority of your post was theory craft, based on unsubstantiated "i remember when" claims, but i am posting because i am adamant that silkworms was written by dizzy reed and chris pitman, Axl says that prior to the performance of the song at rock in rio.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZzfwjPHUdLk
there is the link to him saying who it was written by before the silkworms performance, so don't pin that dreadful song on axl. there was also a negative stigma surrounding axl(and still is) after the initial breakup of the band, which could be attributed to the largely negative reviews of Oh my god. the song itself although sloppy and under produced is actually pretty badass, imo.
Sorry, but I hate this 'Axl is innocent in the Silkworms fiasco' theory. First of all, his band played a song live, after an 8 year hiatus. You chhose to play songs you consider good enough, don't you? You don't play E-side garbage material on your comeback show. Second, Axl wrote the lyrics for sure. he stated in many interviews that he's 'alone lyrically' and nobody else writes lyrics besides him. Guns N' Roses is Axl Rose's band, Silkworms is a Guns N' Roses song Axl played live some times, so if it's a disaster than Axl is responsible for it, since he decides which idea is good enough to be a song, good enough to be recorded and played. He didn't need Tommy's VHG material, but did Silwkorms. He's the boss, so he takes the responsibility.
- Captain Winkler
- Rep: -17
Re: Information on Shackler's Revenge
if he wrote it, why would he point out that the song was written by dizzy and pitman? does he do this with all the songs he writes? "this song is called 'better' and was put together by robin and tommy, this song is called november rain and was put together by duff and steven, this song is called sweet child o mine and was put together by izzy and duff" if he wrote it why would he do that, did/does he think the song was poor and was covering his bases? if he wrote it it would not make sense to say that he didn't.
Re: Information on Shackler's Revenge
Axlin08 wrote:He didn't say that, but he has been critical of the 2002 VMA appearence, and those close have alluded to the fact that he thought Oh My God was this stellar track, even in demo form, and of course it was met with large negative reviews. Silkworms at Rio III was also met with harsh criticism.
the majority of your post was theory craft, based on unsubstantiated "i remember when" claims, but i am posting because i am adamant that silkworms was written by dizzy reed and chris pitman, Axl says that prior to the performance of the song at rock in rio.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZzfwjPHUdLk
there is the link to him saying who it was written by before the silkworms performance, so don't pin that dreadful song on axl. there was also a negative stigma surrounding axl(and still is) after the initial breakup of the band, which could be attributed to the largely negative reviews of Oh my god. the song itself although sloppy and under produced is actually pretty badass, imo.
Unsubstantiated?
Dude, come the fuck on.
You expect me to dig through every single interview by production people, business people, and band members over the years from official interviews to fan chats, to substantiate those claims?
If you don't believe me you don't believe me, but anyone who's been around awhile in this whole CD clusterfuck will back up those kind of statements and references.
I have no clue why you even posted the Silkworms performance. I love the song, but most hate it. I love OMG. But most hate it.
If Axl had faith in that material, it would've come out when the album was still called "2000 Intentions", and Axl would've had the attitude, this rules, and if you don't like it fuck off.
SR proves there's more tracks out there like OMG & SW, and I think SR kicks ass. But they unearthed more Illusion-esque stuff like The Blues, I.R.S. & T.W.A.T. to appease all tastes, which is fine, but certaintly not worth delaying the album for 7-8 years.
if he wrote it, why would he point out that the song was written by dizzy and pitman? does he do this with all the songs he writes? "this song is called 'better' and was put together by robin and tommy, this song is called november rain and was put together by duff and steven, this song is called sweet child o mine and was put together by izzy and duff" if he wrote it why would he do that, did/does he think the song was poor and was covering his bases? if he wrote it it would not make sense to say that he didn't.
He's most likely trying to be fair and give credit to Dizzy & Chris.
But ultimately W. Axl Rose steers the ship of GN'R and HE'S THE SOLE creative director of the band. This is his direction and his wanted "sound", even if Dizzy & Chris are responsible for it's production. Or Robin & Tommy for others. Or Bucket & Brain for others, etc.
Re: Information on Shackler's Revenge
Just occured to me that there's an unreleased track called Shackler's Revenge by Bucket, which was allegedly for a film soundtrack.
Therefore, that track might've been written by Bucket, Brain and Pete Scaturro. B&B would likely be around for a revamped version, to which Robin wrote additional guitars, and Caram Costanzo stirred the melting pot to put everything together. Axl did lyrics.
Now, if the GNR version of SR dates back to 2002, the original Buckethead track was brought in between '00 and '02. Now, what's curious is that Axl requested the demos Izzy and Duff made for the band in '95 to be worked on by the new band in sometime 2000/01.
And if he resurrected an unreleased Buckethead as a rocker for GNR, he was seriously fishing for material in '00/'01. After two-three years of songwriting, Bob Ezrin's comments hit a nerve, it seems. Three good songs and Axl needs an album he's comfortable with. Solution: Pillage everything and forge completely new songs, which would hopefully replace the ones written and worked on excessively between '98-'00.
